Returning to UK for holiday but possibly staying? Advice needed please

[lorluc]

My daughter is travelling back to the UK in October on her australian passport (English passport has expired). She has a return ticket booked for a month later but there is a big possibility if all goes well for her she may not use it.

 

I'm just wondering about the implications of her staying in the UK but having entered the country on an australian passport? Does that matter? I'm assuming that as she was born in the UK and lived there for the first 15 years of her life, and used to have an english passport, (although like i said that expired nearly 3 years ago now) that she can just stay there.

 

Also do you need a visa of some sort to enter the UK for a months holiday on an australian passport? I do remember someone saying to me that if you show them your old english passport at customs even though its expired, you can can enter the UK that way

 

Thanks

Lorraine

Edited August 5, 2013 by lorluc

[Keith & Linda]

My daughter is travelling back to the UK in October on her australian passport (English passport has expired). She has a return ticket booked for a month later but there is a big possibility if all goes well for her she may not use it.

 

I'm just wondering about the implications of her staying in the UK but having entered the country on an australian passport? Does that matter? I'm assuming that as she was born in the UK and lived there for the first 15 years of her life, and used to have an english passport, (although like i said that expired nearly 3 years ago now) that she can just stay there.

 

Also do you need a visa of some sort to enter the UK for a months holiday on an australian passport? I do remember someone saying to me that if you show them your old english passport at customs even though its expired, you can can enter the UK that way

 

Thanks

Lorraine

 

She will need a valid passport to enter the country, in this case her OZ one, take her old UK passport with her as a just incase and I would advise renewing her UK passport asap, this can be done here forms can be downloaded from the web site of british consulate and the completed forms taken to a post office, note only certain post offices do passports check on there website.

 

She is a duel citizen she will have a UK NI number if not then she can apply for one, it is needed for tax purposes. but she can remain in uk forever if she wishes, but I would also reccommend that she always keep her OZ passport upto date, for the sake of a few quid it can save a lot of hassles if something crops up.

 

 

Your airline ticket is normally valid for 1 year the outbound flight must be on the date on the ticket but the return can be changed (some fees may apply)to anytime within the 1yr so long as the original return date has not passed (ticket is not valid then). so I would suggest she changes the date of her return as soon as she knows if she is staying and make the new date for near the end of the 1yr just incase again. It can always be changed again should circumstances change some fees will apply.

 

Hope she has a great time in UK.

[Anne B]

You don't need a visa to enter the UK on an Australian passport if you are on holiday. We recently went back for a holiday, and my son entered on his Australian passport as his UK one had expired. We went through the EU passports line at immigration and showed my son's expired UK passport as well, the guy was really nice, said that showed that he was eligible to live in UK anyway. I don't know if she would get into trouble for overstaying on her Australian passport - immigration may stamp it anyway. My husband's 'right to remain/work' in the UK has expired but the immigration guy stamped his passport allowing him to stay for 6 months (not that we wanted that as we were only there on holiday). The easiest option would be to renew her UK passport before she goes.

[Keith & Linda]

My husband's 'right to remain/work' in the UK has expired but the immigration guy stamped his passport allowing him to stay for 6 months (not that we wanted that as we were only there on holiday). The easiest option would be to renew her UK passport before she goes.

 

Hi Anne B, what's this about your husbands right to work! is he not english? :confused:if you were english born of english parents then you can surely always work in UK He will have a NI number for life and a madical number!

[Anne B]

No, he is Australian. Even if you have the UK equivalent of 'PR' here, you lose it if you leave the UK for more than 2 years. So yes he has a NI number and worked and paid tax for over 12 years in the UK, but now if we ever wanted to go back again and live he would have to apply all over again. Being married to someone for almost 19 years doesn't count for much I'm afraid!

 

Oddly enough though, being a Commonwealth citizen, he always had the right to vote in UK elections, whereas I have no right to vote here until I get citizenship. I thought the American Revolution was all about 'no taxation without representation' - well that right hasn't reached modern day Australia yet!

[Keith & Linda]

 

Oddly enough though, being a Commonwealth citizen, he always had the right to vote in UK elections, whereas I have no right to vote here until I get citizenship. I thought the American Revolution was all about 'no taxation without representation' - well that right hasn't reached modern day Australia yet!

 

Not quite correct Anne B, I have just checked on the electoral commission web site, A commonwealth citizen can only vote if resident in the UK. Also, unless the rules have changed since I last voted from here, UK migrants can vote at any election/referendum during 1st 10yrs of leaving the UK, You do need to register on the electoral role though! thanks for bringing this up Anne B as could be of interest to pia members.

[Anne B]

I think you have misunderstood me a little. When I said he had the right to vote in UK elections - I meant that he (as a Commonwealth citizen) had the right to vote in the UK when he was living in the UK (and on the electoral register). He doesn't want to vote in UK elections any more now he is living back here and I realise that it is is possible for me to vote (somehow) in UK elections whilst living in Australia.

 

My point is that Australia give us Brits less rights than the UK gives Australians.

 

An Australian with PR in the UK can vote in UK elections but

A UK citizen with PR in Australia can not vote in Australian elections

 

To be honest, not being able to vote in Australian elections saves me the burden of deciding whether I prefer KRudd or the Mad Monk Tony!!!

Edited August 5, 2013 by Anne B

[Keith & Linda]

I think you have misunderstood me a little. When I said he had the right to vote in UK elections - I meant that he (as a Commonwealth citizen) had the right to vote in the UK when he was living in the UK (and on the electoral register). When I said I have no right to vote here, I meant that I (as a UK citizen) have no right to vote in Australian elections - I realise that it is is possible to vote (somehow) in UK elections whilst living in Australia, if you really want to. To be honest, not being able to vote in Australian elections saves me the burden of deciding whether I prefer KRudd or the Mad Monk Tony!!!

 

OK all clear now, but still informative for others.. And what is exactly wrong with smarmy up-himself, and I can umm and arr and err all day then?

 

But seriously If you have family connections back in the UK and there is a chance that you may have to return urgently, then get citizenship and OZ passport. save messing with resident return visa's and the risk of not getting let back in. You do not have to vote here you have just got to go down on voting day to get your name checked off.

[Diane]

She'll be fine, she's better off renewing her UK passport when she gets to England, as it costs less, but she'll have no trouble working or staying as long as she likes. Only problem I think she might find is if she wants to study over there, as they have introduced a rule that you have to have lived in the country for three years beforehand or you will be charged international fees. Once a UK citizen, always a UK citizen unless she actively and deliberately gives it up as far as I know.

 

Good luck to her, and to you - I know what it feels like having your offspring that far away: it's like the planet is ever so slightly out of balance, but it will be a great adventure for her.

[lorluc]

She'll be fine, she's better off renewing her UK passport when she gets to England, as it costs less, but she'll have no trouble working or staying as long as she likes. Only problem I think she might find is if she wants to study over there, as they have introduced a rule that you have to have lived in the country for three years beforehand or you will be charged international fees. Once a UK citizen, always a UK citizen unless she actively and deliberately gives it up as far as I know.

 

Good luck to her, and to you - I know what it feels like having your offspring that far away: it's like the planet is ever so slightly out of balance, but it will be a great adventure for her.

 

 

Hi diane,

 

Yes she was planning to renew when she was there due to the cost! But you need it countersigned by someone who has know you 2 years in a certain profession which she wont have, but we will cross that bridge when we come to it.

 

I just needed to know really that by entering the country on an australian passport will it have any implications on how long she can stay there? And of course her expired passport proves she is a uk citizen.

[wizzywozza]

Hannah may have probs if she finds a job over there as when you enter the UK on an Aussie passport it is stamped "leave to enter for six months, employment prohibited, public funds prohibited" ...... so if she suddenly turns up on the tax office data base for example she might have to produce further documents to prove she is entitled to work as the data matching between government departments would flag that she entered the UK as an Australian and is therefore not allowed to work.

[Keith & Linda]

Hi diane,

 

Yes she was planning to renew when she was there due to the cost! But you need it countersigned by someone who has know you 2 years in a certain profession which she wont have, but we will cross that bridge when we come to it.

 

I just needed to know really that by entering the country on an australian passport will it have any implications on how long she can stay there? And of course her expired passport proves she is a uk citizen.

 

Previous threads on this site have explained how to save the pennies, but what do we save them for? surely this is one of those situations where we need to spend those saved pennies! every extra penny you spend now will more than pay for itself in peace of mind, especiall as you are already predicting problems for renerwing in the UK. It may be more expensive to do here but this is one time you can not blame Aus, this is the British government funding its embassies/consulates.

Though I am sure everything will be OK and knowing you wish to do the best for your children as all good parents do, you can make it certain now. A quick check on the web sites for the cost of passports both here and UK will tell you the difference and with the pound gaining strength then that saving is getting smaller.

 

good luck with everything

[snifter]

FWIW, we had to chase our tails trying to get a legal bod to witness our son's UK passport when we moved just within the UK. A new area, no one knew us long enough to witness his child passport etc so it took many phone calls to Gov/passport office who told us what we were supposed to do, trips to magistrate (failed to get the paperwork filled there even though was told it could be done by them and a few other professional people who all declined to sign as they said it was not legal to do so ) and more. Wasted 3-4 days of our time, plus travel costs and costs of magistrate, hubby taking time off work, stress of it all and more. In the end I drove a 200 mile round trip for a Doctor friend to sign the passport application as they had known me for over the required 2 years and my son since birth.

 

Personally I'd get a new UK one before leaving Aus for peace of mind and all that, and the knowing someone for 2 year thing is far more easily solved while still in Aus.

Edited August 5, 2013 by snifter
Edited a bit

[Guest Claire-n-tel]

I think it is about $250 to renew it from here from memory, the price in the UK works out about $125, so ok its double the price but like others have said probably easier and more piece of mind, a night out with dinner would probably cost $125!

[Keith & Linda]

I think it is about $250 to renew it from here from memory, the price in the UK works out about $125, so ok its double the price but like others have said probably easier and more piece of mind, a night out with dinner would probably cost $125!

 

Cost to renew in OZ $282, cost in UK (at post office) 81 pounds at current tourist rate of $1 = 55p which gives a UK dollar price of $150 so as you say claire approx double. there will be photo costs too. the post office here do that as part of the whole passport service, still pay for it though. The wife and I recently renewed ours filled the forms out on the net print them off and away you go to the post office with your old passport and money and they take care of the rest.

the only thing which will need checking is if the passport is too long out of date!

[lorluc]

Thank you everyone. Decision made she's getting a brit passport done before she goes.

 

So i have another question now....do you have to enter and leave on the same passport? Like i said atm we have no idea if she is staying in the UK or not. If she enters UK on her brit passport and then stays in the UK...thats all fine, but if she decides she is taking the return flight back here after all, can she leave the UK on her aussie passport having entered on a brit passport?

 

Sorry am getting rather confused!

[Keith & Linda]

Thank you everyone. Decision made she's getting a brit passport done before she goes.

 

So i have another question now....do you have to enter and leave on the same passport? Like i said atm we have no idea if she is staying in the UK or not. If she enters UK on her brit passport and then stays in the UK...thats all fine, but if she decides she is taking the return flight back here after all, can she leave the UK on her aussie passport having entered on a brit passport?

 

Sorry am getting rather confused!

 

Great the best and correct option.

 

She needs to leave Aus on her Aus passport, she needs to enter the UK on her British passport, she could enter on her Aus one but less hassles and quicker on British. However she will have to leave England on her Aus passport as the airlines have a legal responsibility to check you have valid entry to the country you are going to, and of course enter Aus on her Aus passport. My Wife and I use both our passports like this all the time even when travelling to other countries where a visa may be required for say Aus but not Brit.

 

Remember about changing return dates on her ticket asap or she will lose it!

Happy travels:smile:

Edited August 6, 2013 by Keith & Linda
more info added

[lorluc]

Great the best and correct option.

 

She needs to leave Aus on her Aus passport, she needs to enter the UK on her British passport, she could enter on her Aus one but less hassles and quicker on British. However she will have to leave England on her Aus passport as the airlines have a legal responsibility to check you have valid entry to the country you are going to, and of course enter Aus on her Aus passport. My Wife and I use both our passports like this all the time even when travelling to other countries where a visa may be required for say Aus but not Brit.

 

Remember about changing return dates on her ticket asap or she will lose it!

Happy travels:smile:

 

Thank you Keith, you have been very helpful. We have just over 9 weeks until she goes. It says on the website that renewals take about 4 weeks so should be okay with the timeframe Her previous UK passport was a child one so if i'm reading it right she just needs to renew it to an adult one. It even says if pic still similar (was taken when she was 15) dont have to do countersignee stuff, and she hasnt changed much in 8 years, but i think we may still do it just in case.

[Keith & Linda]

Thank you Keith, you have been very helpful. We have just over 9 weeks until she goes. It says on the website that renewals take about 4 weeks so should be okay with the timeframe Her previous UK passport was a child one so if i'm reading it right she just needs to renew it to an adult one. It even says if pic still similar (was taken when she was 15) dont have to do countersignee stuff, and she hasnt changed much in 8 years, but i think we may still do it just in case.

 

Might be well worth an enquiry visit to the post office with your daughter and old passport and ask them, as it is at their discretion and hope you get a kind assistant that day, could always try another post office too. But we have always found them very helpful especially on a quite day.

My wife and I did ours together earlier this year hers was back in 2 weeks mine was 5!. When we renewed our Aus ones a few years ago they came back together and were consecutive numbers!

good luck

[Diane]

Hannah may have probs if she finds a job over there as when you enter the UK on an Aussie passport it is stamped "leave to enter for six months, employment prohibited, public funds prohibited" ...... so if she suddenly turns up on the tax office data base for example she might have to produce further documents to prove she is entitled to work as the data matching between government departments would flag that she entered the UK as an Australian and is therefore not allowed to work.

 

Lucy went over on her Aussie passport, took her expired British one to get it renewed there (was going to get her old school teacher - now headmistress - to authorise for her: we've been FB friends since we moved here so she has kept up with changes in Lucy's appearance etc) but never got round to it (what can I say - you can lead a horse to water etc etc!!)

 

She had no probs working or getting paid over there even though she'd entered on her Aussie passport, just had to apply for a NI number which went through fine (in fact, now she's back, she remembers that a lot better than her TFN!!)

[snifter]

Thank you everyone. Decision made she's getting a brit passport done before she goes.

 

So i have another question now....do you have to enter and leave on the same passport? Like i said atm we have no idea if she is staying in the UK or not. If she enters UK on her brit passport and then stays in the UK...thats all fine, but if she decides she is taking the return flight back here after all, can she leave the UK on her aussie passport having entered on a brit passport?

 

Sorry am getting rather confused!

 

The only thing different I will add to what Keith has said is that yes, at check ins with the airline she should show her Aus passport. However, when going through UK immigration check to leave the UK she should show her UK one.

 

Basically you depart and enter Aus on Aus pp and enter and depart UK on UK pp.

 

As your daughter will hold 2 passports she should show the airline checks her Aus one as that is the country of origin and where she flew from. Also it will confirm with them she does not need a visa to travel to Aus.

 

Son and hubby hold both passports and we do the above. It's very straightforward really.

[lorluc]

The only thing different I will add to what Keith has said is that yes, at check ins with the airline she should show her Aus passport. However, when going through UK immigration check to leave the UK she should show her UK one.

 

Basically you depart and enter Aus on Aus pp and enter and depart UK on UK pp.

 

As your daughter will hold 2 passports she should show the airline checks her Aus one as that is the country of origin and where she flew from. Also it will confirm with them she does not need a visa to travel to Aus.

 

Son and hubby hold both passports and we do the above. It's very straightforward really.

 

 

Wont leaving the UK on your brit passport make them flag up..oh you need a visa to get into australia?? Someone else told me today to use aussie passport when leaving UK as they will ask that very question.

[snifter]

Wont leaving the UK on your brit passport make them flag up..oh you need a visa to get into australia?? Someone else told me today to use aussie passport when leaving UK as they will ask that very question.

 

If you hold a passport for a country you should use that to enter and depart said country from. It is logged and so on in the system. So UK for UK, Aus for Aus.

 

And no it won't. Dual passport carriers (Aus and UK) won't need a visa to enter Aus as they hold the passport and can show it when asked. They simply show their Aus passport to the airline check in and the airline checks etc and clearing immigration they show the countries passport. Those are the people who want to see an Aus passport in the UK as the trip was booked in Aus and originated from there. So they need to see the correct passport to show a visa is not needed when they fly you.

[snifter]

I copied this from the Aus embassy site. The same will apply for UK citizens entering and departing the UK, UK passport. Hope it makes sense. If you enter the UK on your UK passport, you should leave on it also as they will have recorded your entry on your UK one. Passports from different countries are not linked so your daughter won't be shown on the database as having departed the UK if she shows her Aus passport to immigration. The whole point of having the passport is to enable you to enter and leave as a citizen of that country. Same for Aus, she will leave on her Aus one, it will be logged and it will log her as returning on it when she comes back to Aus.

 

Q9 - I have an Australian passport and a British passport; which passport do I use when entering Australia?

To avoid delays at airline check-in and again at the border entry point, Australian citizens who are dual nationals are required to depart and enter Australia on their Australian passport. An Australian citizen cannot be granted a visa for Australia in a foreign passport.

When entering Australia, all Australians, including those who hold dual nationality, must be able to prove that they are an Australian citizen. An Australian passport is conclusive evidence of a person's identity and citizenship, and provides the holder with unfettered right of entry to Australia.

International airlines have an obligation to ensure that they only carry appropriately documented passengers to Australia. In the absence of an Australian passport, airlines are unable to assess a person's claim to Australian citizenship at the time of check-in and may decline to carry the traveller.

 

 

 

 

[Anne B]

My children have dual nationality but my son only has 1 (Australian) passport at the moment.

 

When leaving Heathrow a couple of weeks ago, when we checked in at the airline desk we showed the Australian passports to the airline so that they could see that the holder has the right to enter Australia (for me it was Uk passport and visa). We were intending to show the Uk passports at border/passport control, but they didn't even ask to see our passports. So the thing about entering and leaving the UK on your UK passport isn't all that important as they don't even bother to check. We've had this happen before, dutifully trying to show our passports but they aren't interested! It's only Australia where they make you queue up and scrutinise your passports when you leave.