I don’t normally post on here as that has become the domain of my better half, however, I have read a couple of comments on this thread that I feel I need to address.
Muppetbro in particular has made comments relating to ‘christian ethics’. The behaviours being extolled as evidence of such ethics may be laudable in some ways but are not in themselves Christian. I therefore feel it necessary to explain from the perspective of someone who is one what being a Christian is actually about. Apologies to anyone who feels they re being preached at but some may find the following of interest.
Firstly being a Christian requires acceptance that God created the world we live in and therefore us. Secondly a Christian accepts that we do not live as God intended and that we are all sinful. Before anyone says they have never done anything really wrong sin occurs in the things that we do and, probably most importantly for most of us, the things that we don’t do. On this basis we all sin every day of our lives, (I know that I am a serial sinner) and we are all on the same ‘sin scale’ but at different points of it. Thirdly, and most importantly, a Christian believes and accepts that God sent Jesus Christ to atone for our sins and grant us salvation and eternal life in heaven.
In short that is it and is the ultimate conundrum in that in some ways being a Christian is the easiest thing in the world to be but also the hardest.
Coming back to muppetbro’s comment about Christian ethics there would be many that you could put on a list and everyone’s would differ. ‘Work hard and play hard’ could only be viewed as a Christian ethic is it is applied to activities that are in line with God’s will and plan for us as individuals. For example, we are prepared to work hard at our move to Australia because we believe that God wants us to make this move.
‘Modest expectations’ is not part of the Christian ethic because the Christian ethic is to live our lives as God intended. Attempting to do this is really hard and presents huge challenges in every day life, particularly in the world we live in today. The Christian ethic, therefore is to have very high expectations and at the end of the day you can’t have a higher expectation than eternal life in heaven.
A ‘positive outlook’ is definitely a Christian ethic as you definitely need to have that. There would be many other ethics that I could mention such as loving ones fellow man no matter who they are, sacrificial giving which believe me can be really hard in this very materialistic world of ours. I could go on and on but won’t.
One thing that I do have to point out, however, is that despite what muppetbro may think religion and Christianity are not necessarily the same thing. Hypocrisy and snobbery are definitely contrary to Christian beliefs but you are as likely to find Christians falling foul of these sins as any other sins. Muppetbro himself illustrates hypocrisy perfectly by claiming to have brought up his children with ‘the Christian ethic’ yet starts his post with ‘oh my god’. The use of this phrase is offensive in the extreme to any Christian and is contrary to all Christian ethics. This is a phrase that I see on this and other forums a lot (OMG is just as bad) and I would ask that people refrain for using phraseology which is offensive to those of us who are Christians, after all in the current climate no-one would go round saying ‘Oh My Allah’.
Now that I have got that off my chest I feel much better. If any of the above sparks any questions off with anyone please feel free to pm either me or Ali, we don’t claim to have anything like all the answers bit would be happy to answer as best we can.
Now my OH has had his say I would like to say I am very proud of him for standing up for what we believe in. Everybody has a right to thier own views and their are no rose tinted glasses here. These are our views and we think they are right but everybody has a right to their own views and pleasent discusion is always welcome. By challenging other peoples views we all learn and grow but they do not have a right to slate other peoples views and speak disparegingly about other peoples ideology.
That said I will get off my soap box.
And say graham I sooooooooooooo agree with you it is easier to attack other people because they dont fall in line with your views but it is much harder to come up with positive view points that help and dont put people down. I dont want to run away from the Uk because we have a bad life here(because we dont) but I am aiming for somthing better and I hope we will find it in AU. Everybody on this forum is taking a leap of faith and aiming high. We may not make it but if you dont try you will never know.
So good luck to everybody Muppetbro icluded because everybody here is doing somthing very brave and positive that most people dont understand and whoever they are they deserve a pat on the back for that
i would just like to say that whilst i am not a church goer i feel that peoples beliefs are their own business and no-one should be belittled for what they believe. i personally believe, and have tried to bring my children up to believe that you should treat people as you would wish to be treated yourself. i envy people who do have strong beliefs.i know it brought great peace and comfort to a close relative of mine during very trying times. that said i think we may be getting off the thread a little!!!! the question is "why are you going to australia" the simple and effective answer in the words of one Miss Piper is BECAUSE WE WANT TO.
you are right to say that every one has a right to thier own belifes and I would storngly agree with you. But to say we are getting off the thread I feel is a little unreasonable. Threads start off on a topic and in the hope of open disscusion we have to follow the line it takes. We may not always be comforable with what is said but at the end of the day that is what open discussion is about. If we follow the thread we have to go with the flow it is a bit like chinese whispers and whether we are happy with that or not we just have to follow the flow.
I know that religion is not always a comfortable subject but it allways does start discusion and difficullt should not mean banned.
Im sorry if we have got hold of the wrong end of the stick but this is what we feel.:D
hi ali, i wasnt uncomfortable with the subject but i am still fairly new to the forum and thought maybe discussions were meant to stay on the subject matter!to be honest this is the only forum i've ever been on and i'm not sure of the protocol, or do i mean ettiquette? its nice to be able to chat with people going through the same thing.i'd like to think that i have something to contribute and i know that i've found some really useful info just from browsing the different threads.
I totally agree with you-we are all taking on huge leap of faith in uprooting to the other side of the world-that's one thing everyone on this site should realise.It's a shame this thread has got heated and some people upset,I don't think anyone intentionally meant that to happen.Thank goodness people do have their own opinions-life 'd be pretty boring otherwise,but tolerance of others opinions should be shown,there's enough intolerance and discrimination around at home and elsewhere,without it happening here!
Love from the Francis clan!
(oh and-go Billie!):o
having re-read my 2nd post of last night without the benifit of alcohol I think I might have been a little over assertive. I still stand by my views but wish I had said it a little more gently. Sorry tiger fan I didnt mean to jump down your throat. Dont let my drunken ramblings put you off I am quite nice really;)
a little heated
Just read all the posts from y-day, Hope everyone cherishes the air we breathe and the people we have in our life ,am not religious but i do believe in free speech and am bringing my daughter up to treat people the way she want`s to be treated in life!!!!!!!!
Life is so short so live ,love and smile and the world will smile with you!!!!!!!!!
ok rather than a debate on religion or the views of others can we please stick to the original topic things seem to be getting a little personal in some of these replies.
that will be a smack for all of us from the smack fairy sorry lisa;)