Are things really that bad!!

[Guest kangomik]

you have to work hard to get a job here, you have to work hard to keep it.

You have to be prepared to try every trick in the book, and if thats cold calling and off the chance posting then i would be doing it. It's about getting the edge, being one step ahead of the rest who expect to open saturdays paper and because it's advertised then it must be the job for them.

 

There's a phrase, "aussie jobs for aussie people" and yes they do look after there own. Am i against it...... no not really.

You can have loads of qualifications from a different country, most of us have some, but to be frank they are not recognised here, its a foreign language.

 

Take any job, theres not much differenece from casual supermarket to agreement rate trades, in fact i know that casual in a supermarket pays more than some if not a few trade rates.

Take the job and let the networking begin.

 

I have said it before, when i got off the plane at Adelaide i just did not see the sign that some others have.

"Welcome to Australia, we now owe YOU a living"

[Guest soggy]

What? A fair chance for everyone you mean?? Heaven forfend! Where on earth would it lead?! Jeez we'll all be banning Xmas next eh?

 

Discrimination is something that Australia sooner or later needs to start addressing and addressing seriously.

 

 

I'm pretty sure it's the equal opps form Diane was against, as am I, why do you need to short list people who are non white or not Austraian or non male, the people should be short listed because of the suitability for the job on offer and nothing else should matter, that is equal oppotunity.

 

Simon

[jim and adel]

In my 40+ job applications, I have yet to complete and equal opps form. Thus I would challenge any organisation to tell me the actual numbers of non white, non- Australian males or females that they shortlist for interview. I think such figures would surprise a few. This goes for both private industry and local government/not for profits etc. If this isn't being monitored, how does anyone challenge it? ...

 

I personally do NOT feel that Australia owes me a living and I would venture to suggest, few people on this forum are that naive. What I do think is that is owes me the same chance as anyone else...

 

Regarding monitoring forms, I wasn't suggesting that exactly the same mechanisms are used here as in the UK, but that there are more recruitment similarities than differences. Depending on the type and size of organisation, an annual EOWA compliance report is required and I find this more comprehensive (and onerous to compile) than anything of its type that I came across in the UK, so 'swings and roundabouts' comes to mind.

 

Interestingly, there's surprisingly little to suggest that monitoring forms or other types of scrutiny drive social change i.e. increase work participation in under represented groups. What they're far more likely to do is track social changes as they're happening.

 

As for using such information to 'challenge' an organisation, as a new arrival my emphasis would be on landing a job, not raising a grievance.

 

Regardless of what organisations have to report, though, the point I was making is that people, not organisations, make recruitment decisions, and the things that influence them are pretty much the same here as in the UK - 'is this the best candidate?' 'could I really work with this person day in, day out?' 'would they fit in?' 'do their skills add to what we already have/fill a gap?' 'is their experience relevant/ their knowledge and skills transferable?' and, of course, 'can I do a friend a favour?'

 

Finally, I don't think Australia owes me anything. I applied to come here and was allowed to do so. I knew the risks and that its migration policy is fairly mercenary and based on human capital, not altruism. I also knew that during the first year of arrival, skilled migrants have higher unemployment than their Aussie counterparts - and that by 18 months they have higher employment (and that by this stage, native English speaking migrants earn more than the national average).

 

Jim

[Guest 0125dannydanny]

Hi , just been reading peoples posts about the time it can take on finding a job. after reading your husband is a plumber but does something else now, could I still do that then? I'm a Chef but need to get my 12 months experience within the last 24 months. I am serious about moving over and am saving. I only rent and would be going over on my own. with the state sponsored visa , can you work in some other trade? and still (hopefull) get the visa that allows you to stay after 2 years?

[Guest fuji70]

 

Regardless of what organisations have to report, though, the point I was making is that people, not organisations, make recruitment decisions, and the things that influence them are pretty much the same here as in the UK - 'is this the best candidate?' 'could I really work with this person day in, day out?' 'would they fit in?' 'do their skills add to what we already have/fill a gap?' 'is their experience relevant/ their knowledge and skills transferable?' and, of course, 'can I do a friend a favour?'

 

Finally, I don't think Australia owes me anything. I applied to come here and was allowed to do so. I knew the risks and that its migration policy is fairly mercenary and based on human capital, not altruism. I also knew that during the first year of arrival, skilled migrants have higher unemployment than their Aussie counterparts - and that by 18 months they have higher employment (and that by this stage, native English speaking migrants earn more than the national average).

 

Jim

 

Your first point I disagree with entirely and I think that there are enough people struggling to find work on this forum that would back me up. I applied for several positions where my job description and experience in the UK matched identically and yet I didn't even get an interview. I would refute the suggestion that Australian employers look at all resumes and simply decide on the most appropriate candidate. (It would be interesting to see if foreign workers in the UK feel the same way)

 

Secondly, does Australia owe me anything? Yes, a CHANCE. Equal opportunities with my Aussie counterparts in terms of employment (otherwise why sponsor people to move over here for goodness sake?!). This isn't Vietnam where I was officially treated as a foreigner and therby entitled to a lot less. We have either been sponsored to live and work here or we haven't.

 

These half arsed measures are causing a lot of people a lot of stress.

[Guest fuji70]

I'm pretty sure it's the equal opps form Diane was against, as am I, why do you need to short list people who are non white or not Austraian or non male, the people should be short listed because of the suitability for the job on offer and nothing else should matter, that is equal oppotunity.

 

Simon

 

TRUE, but history and reality dictate that this doesn't happen and equal opps forms are a good way (however annoying) of noting this and attempting to deal with it.

 

Otherwise we would losing out on some cracking male nurses and female engineers etc etc etc etc .....

[Guest fuji70]

Hi , just been reading peoples posts about the time it can take on finding a job. after reading your husband is a plumber but does something else now, could I still do that then? I'm a Chef but need to get my 12 months experience within the last 24 months. I am serious about moving over and am saving. I only rent and would be going over on my own. with the state sponsored visa , can you work in some other trade? and still (hopefull) get the visa that allows you to stay after 2 years?

 

If you come over on a 475, you can take ANY position. In fact you may be hard pushed to find work in your profession initially, in fact many people treat it as a great opportunity for a career change.

 

I also came over alone and have (eventually) managed to find work in my field, but many of my friends do other things.

 

Good luck with the move

[Guest ben&sharon]

Hi , just been reading peoples posts about the time it can take on finding a job. after reading your husband is a plumber but does something else now, could I still do that then? I'm a Chef but need to get my 12 months experience within the last 24 months. I am serious about moving over and am saving. I only rent and would be going over on my own. with the state sponsored visa , can you work in some other trade? and still (hopefull) get the visa that allows you to stay after 2 years?

 

 

My husband was a plumber, but we didn't use that at all in our application; I'm a qualified accountant and had had several years employment with the same company in the UK, so it was much easier for me to apply than him. We've got PR, so I'm not entirely up with the working requirements for your 12 months experience, but I'm pretty sure you can do anything during that time, so long as you are working - I don't think they can punish you for not working in your field if there are no jobs available.

 

I'm sure someone on here will correct me if I'm wrong, and can fill in the details for you..........

 

Best of luck,

 

Sharon.

[jim and adel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jim and adel

Regardless of what organisations have to report, though, the point I was making is that people, not organisations, make recruitment decisions, and the things that influence them are pretty much the same here as in the UK - 'is this the best candidate?' 'could I really work with this person day in, day out?' 'would they fit in?' 'do their skills add to what we already have/fill a gap?' 'is their experience relevant/ their knowledge and skills transferable?' and, of course, 'can I do a friend a favour?'

 

Finally, I don't think Australia owes me anything. I applied to come here and was allowed to do so. I knew the risks and that its migration policy is fairly mercenary and based on human capital, not altruism. I also knew that during the first year of arrival, skilled migrants have higher unemployment than their Aussie counterparts - and that by 18 months they have higher employment (and that by this stage, native English speaking migrants earn more than the national average).

 

Jim

 

 

Your first point I disagree with entirely and I think that there are enough people struggling to find work on this forum that would back me up. I applied for several positions where my job description and experience in the UK matched identically and yet I didn't even get an interview. I would refute the suggestion that Australian employers look at all resumes and simply decide on the most appropriate candidate. (It would be interesting to see if foreign workers in the UK feel the same way)

 

Secondly, does Australia owe me anything? Yes, a CHANCE. Equal opportunities with my Aussie counterparts in terms of employment (otherwise why sponsor people to move over here for goodness sake?!). This isn't Vietnam where I was officially treated as a foreigner and therby entitled to a lot less. We have either been sponsored to live and work here or we haven't.

 

You seem to be reading things in my words that aren't there. I've not suggested that Australian employers look at all résumés - why would you think that? If an employer is using an e-recruitment system, a good portion of those résumés are unlikely to be read by anyone; they'll be filtered out to save the recruiter time and effort. Even without technology, if an employer regularly gets 100+ applications for its easy-to-fill roles, do you think they will go through each and every one of them? Some might, but the majority won't - either here or in the UK - and I'm surprised if you think otherwise. So, there's nothing in my response about employers reading all résumés.

 

I'm not sure that just because there are lots of people struggling to find work that this substantiates your argument; after all, Adelaide is a competitive market place and migrants always have it tougher than the native population, but we all knew that before making the move ... didn't we?

 

Am I saying that it's perfect? No, of course not (just in case you thought it was in my words somewhere). Adelaide has its faults, its discrimination, its shortcomings; if you find a place that doesn't, I'd be pleased to hear about it. Just because someone doesn't land a job, though, doesn't mean that these faults are at play in their case; there are many more likely reasons why someone is unsuccessful, and if being unsuccessful is a trend then the harsh reality is that those reasons are becoming more and more likely ...

 

As a point of accuracy, you assume that all migrants are sponsored; far from it, there are many skilled independent visa holders without state, family or employer sponsors.

 

Finally (and it will be - I've no interest in repeatedly socking the ball back to you, only for you to return it with spin) I repeat that I think Australia owes me nothing. Zip, zero, nullpunkt, rien, a big fat circle with a hole in its centre.

 

Jim

[Guest fuji70]

You've certainly misinterpreted much of what I said too. But likewise...I'm too busy trying to cool down to continue the argument. I stand by my opinion, for as long as I can stand anywhere in this flippin heat...

[Guest mercury]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jim and adel

 

Regardless of what organisations have to report, though, the point I was making is that people, not organisations, make recruitment decisions, and the things that influence them are pretty much the same here as in the UK - 'is this the best candidate?' 'could I really work with this person day in, day out?' 'would they fit in?' 'do their skills add to what we already have/fill a gap?' 'is their experience relevant/ their knowledge and skills transferable?' and, of course, 'can I do a friend a favour?'

 

Finally, I don't think Australia owes me anything. I applied to come here and was allowed to do so. I knew the risks and that its migration policy is fairly mercenary and based on human capital, not altruism. I also knew that during the first year of arrival, skilled migrants have higher unemployment than their Aussie counterparts - and that by 18 months they have higher employment (and that by this stage, native English speaking migrants earn more than the national average).

 

Jim

 

 

 

 

You seem to be reading things in my words that aren't there. I've not suggested that Australian employers look at all résumés - why would you think that? If an employer is using an e-recruitment system, a good portion of those résumés are unlikely to be read by anyone; they'll be filtered out to save the recruiter time and effort. Even without technology, if an employer regularly gets 100+ applications for its easy-to-fill roles, do you think they will go through each and every one of them? Some might, but the majority won't - either here or in the UK - and I'm surprised if you think otherwise. So, there's nothing in my response about employers reading all résumés.

 

I'm not sure that just because there are lots of people struggling to find work that this substantiates your argument; after all, Adelaide is a competitive market place and migrants always have it tougher than the native population, but we all knew that before making the move ... didn't we?

 

Am I saying that it's perfect? No, of course not (just in case you thought it was in my words somewhere). Adelaide has its faults, its discrimination, its shortcomings; if you find a place that doesn't, I'd be pleased to hear about it. Just because someone doesn't land a job, though, doesn't mean that these faults are at play in their case; there are many more likely reasons why someone is unsuccessful, and if being unsuccessful is a trend then the harsh reality is that those reasons are becoming more and more likely ...

 

As a point of accuracy, you assume that all migrants are sponsored; far from it, there are many skilled independent visa holders without state, family or employer sponsors.

 

Finally (and it will be - I've no interest in repeatedly socking the ball back to you, only for you to return it with spin) I repeat that I think Australia owes me nothing. Zip, zero, nullpunkt, rien, a big fat circle with a hole in its centre.

 

Jim

 

I am 100% with Fuji70 on this one. I think Australia OWES both migrants and Australians a fair chance (otherwise scrap the immigration program). If Australians could do all these jobs, the Oz govt. would not be running the immigration program. If Australians feel that they getting screwed, vote out your leaders. Migrants don't vote and I am sick of Oz society blaming migrants for all their incompetencies. After all, most present day Australians are migrants or descendants of.

 

Jim, congrats on derailing the argument . It is a classic and time honoured way of avoiding discussing issues.

[Guest mercury]

This is the kind of political correctness I left England to escape!

 

 

I hope that you are discriminated against in the course of your career because you are a woman then we shall see how long you continue calling it political correctness!

[Guest Mrs Brentus]

I was over here for a month before i got accepted for a really good job, i've been really lucky and i think some of it is in what jobs are about at the time, and your determination.

[Guest HalfPom]

I have been studying this and a few other aussie forums for many months and now I am in a state of total "don't know what to do". Most of what I have read tells stories of people struggling to find jobs having been in Adelaide for anything from 2 to 18 months.

 

We have our house up for sale and will be over as soon as we can. My worries are now that by the time we arrive, my husband will be 47 years old (I am 43) and we are now thinking that he is going to struggle to find work because of this. We are not coming over on skilled visas - he is a kiwi - so family visa. At present he works in the car industry (plastic moulding). Me, I would be very happy with a little part time job - eg receptionist at a gym or sweeper upper at a hairdressers - I'm not wanting an IT or medical job, so are these types of smaller jobs around and are we likely to find that companies would rather employ younger people as they do here because its cheaper.

 

I'm sorry I seem to have waffled on a bit but I am really worried that I will be tearing my family apart (my daughter is staying here is England) without any means of earning money to make a return visit once a year. Don't get me wrong we are far from lazy people and certainly don't expect opportunities to land at our feet. And no we are not a couple who think we are going to be better off in Oz than the UK with a massive mortgage free house, we are prepared to work hard and enjoy a more outdoor lifestyle than here.

 

Hope someone can shed some light

 

Hi, HalfPom here, I think it would help you if you logged on to some of the job websites to get a feel for what you are looking. Adelaide has been fairly good in regard to employment over the last year. I have put a few URL's for you below. I just typed in "Jobs Adelaide South Australia"

 

indeed.com.au/Positions-Vacant

 

Adelaide : Jobs Jobs Adelaide Free Classifieds Job Ads Find Work

 

Employment & Vacant Job Listings - Find Employment Classifieds, Job Classifieds & More - Trading Post

 

Jobs Adelaide - Employment - Work - Gumtree Adelaide Free Classifieds

[Guest Messua]

I have been studying this and a few other aussie forums for many months and now I am in a state of total "don't know what to do". Most of what I have read tells stories of people struggling to find jobs having been in Adelaide for anything from 2 to 18 months.

 

We have our house up for sale and will be over as soon as we can. My worries are now that by the time we arrive, my husband will be 47 years old (I am 43) and we are now thinking that he is going to struggle to find work because of this. We are not coming over on skilled visas - he is a kiwi - so family visa. At present he works in the car industry (plastic moulding). Me, I would be very happy with a little part time job - eg receptionist at a gym or sweeper upper at a hairdressers - I'm not wanting an IT or medical job, so are these types of smaller jobs around and are we likely to find that companies would rather employ younger people as they do here because its cheaper.

 

I'm sorry I seem to have waffled on a bit but I am really worried that I will be tearing my family apart (my daughter is staying here is England) without any means of earning money to make a return visit once a year. Don't get me wrong we are far from lazy people and certainly don't expect opportunities to land at our feet. And no we are not a couple who think we are going to be better off in Oz than the UK with a massive mortgage free house, we are prepared to work hard and enjoy a more outdoor lifestyle than here.

 

Hope someone can shed some light

 

Finally, someone our age! I'm 44 and Hubby is 47. You both have skills which is a very good place to start. You are right that it's cheaper to employ younger people, but experience also counts for something so don't give up hope. The car industry is starting to pick up again, so I'm told, so I think with skill and experience your husband could do well. Good luck to both of you and a safe journey to Adelaide.:v_SPIN:

[Guest Guest5035]

Finally, someone our age! I'm 44 and Hubby is 47.

:v_SPIN:

 

i wish i was.

 

stevo

[Guest Guest75]

Finally, someone our age! I'm 44 and Hubby is 47. .:v_SPIN:

 

I've got 4 years on your hubby,there are a few of us dinosaurs out there.

 

Just a shame my brain isn't catching up with my body!!

[Guest Guest5035]

I've got 4 years on your hubby,there are a few of us dinosaurs out there.

 

Just a shame my brain isn't catching up with my body!!

 

again.......................i wish i was.

 

stevo

 

feeling older by each post

[Guest Guest75]

again.......................i wish i was.

 

stevo

 

feeling older by each post

 

Ya old git............ there Tis' done;)

[Guest kangomik]

Don't let the young uns get to ya Stevo ( ya old fart)

[Guest cornish Busdriver]

Ive just spent the last hour reading through all the post and now thinking "What the hell is all the whinging about". Now i dont mean to stamp on anyones toes here or affend anyone either but Australia never promiced me a living or a great life, when they gave me my visa all they gave me was a change to make and do somthing with it and thats exactly what ive done. Now my job is not the best paid, the hours and shifts can be a pain and its not even close to my chosen field, the missus works as a nurse at flinders and so far in the 15 months that i have been here and 12 months for the missus has we have now an amazing big house with pool something we always thought was impossible, 2 good cars, a more relaxed lifestyle and get to spend more time together. We've had loads of knock backs along the way but just got back up and got on with it so if you just sit there whinging about equal oppitunities - australia owe's me this and that; your not gonna get anywhere and also remember the saying from the UK "british jobs for british people" Well what go's around comes around and bites you in the ass as they say.

[sueoc]

That's your negative opinion,not mine.

[sueoc]

Not true. The fact that you CAN do the job seems to be way down the list, especially if you've done the job outside of Australia. Again I can only speak from my own experiences but when you get a rejection letter stating that despite your experience and qualifications matching the job criteria, they were able to shortlist people who 'more closely' matched them, you know you're in for the long haul.

 

I know of marketing execs, PAs and people who worked in finance and PR in the UK and NONE of them have found work in their own professions here despite many years of experience.

 

It's do-able, but it's more to do with luck than resumes.

Not true eh!That's your negative opinion,not mine.

[Guest mayjess]

Seems to me thats some ppl have very short memories and whinged about lots of things that went wrong in OZ before things went great!

 

Its human nature, we all like a good ol moan now & again, got to let it out sometimes !!!!

 

Mayjess