minkyme29

Your experiences of parent migration please...

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    I know there are a fair few of us on here who have or want our parents to move out to be near us and their grandchildren.

     

    I'm keen to hear your stories as my Inlaws are excited at the prospect of us sponsoring them to come out once we get PR. The problem is that I think they probably wouldn't pass the balance of family criteria as my FIL has 4 children from a previous marriage. Plus they both have health issues. FIL is elderly (aged 86) with diabetes and a dodgy hip and MIL, who is in her early 60s, has just had her second knee replacement, has had two hip replacements due to arthritis, has thyroid probs, is severely overweight, and has an irregular heart beat etc. She is taking a fair chunk of medication too.

     

    So what we're wondering is if there is any way they could come out as temp visa holders and simply renew whilst onshore. I have heard all sorts of stories and recently met an Irish lady who didn't pass the balance of family test but has been here for 9 years on a 4 year temp visa that she renews onshore and has settled in to a home that she had built here too. She has to have full medical insurance because there is no reciprocal agreement between Ireland and Australia. Would our relatives be entitled to reciprocal health care if here on a temp visa?

     

    I'd be grateful to anyone who can share their ideas/experiences as we're keen to help my Inlaws plan for their future.

     

    Thanks :wacko:

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    Guest Stacey

    Hi it's a minefield isn't it lol!!

     

    I'm not sure about temp visas but they definitely can't get out here on the parent visa if they don't pass the balance of family test. I actually wrote to immigration regarding this a short while ago.

     

    My mum was looking to come out, there is only me and my brother as her children which is great, but her husband (who she married 5 years ago) has two children who are in their forties and they are also now unfortunately included.

     

    This in effect means there are four of us so she fails the test! Immigration confirmed that they don't care about the ages of step children, their relationship with the natural parent or whether they have ever been financially dependent on the step parent, it is what it is and step children are included so if you fail you fail that is it!

     

    Sorry to not give you better news but certainly I will be interested if you find out anything further regarding the temp visa situation.

     

    Good luck

     

    Stacey

    x

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    Guest mimasawrus

    Hi Ya

     

    I dont have any experience re parent migration yet, but my mum is keen to join us when we have PR so it is a big subject in my mind, my situation is not however as complicated as yours, but it may well be worth you contacting Gollywobbler because I have asked her a few questions about parent migration and the answers have helped me, so she may be able to help you with your questions.

     

    Good luck

     

    Laura x:)

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    Hi Ya

     

    I dont have any experience re parent migration yet, but my mum is keen to join us when we have PR so it is a big subject in my mind, my situation is not however as complicated as yours, but it may well be worth you contacting Gollywobbler because I have asked her a few questions about parent migration and the answers have helped me, so she may be able to help you with your questions.

     

    Good luck

     

    Laura x:)

     

    Thanks Laura - that's very helpful , have sent a pm to Gollywobbler. :)

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    Guest katsmajic

    Gollywobbler is definately the person to contact - she knows everything there is to know about parent migration :notworthy::notworthy:

     

    My mum is over on a holiday visa - her 2nd - she came over last year, 1 yr tourist visa valid for 6mth stays, she stayed for 2 6mth stints, this year the visas changed and she has another 1 yr tourists visa but has to go off shore every 3 mths (ouch)...

    so shes off to bali in june for a bit of sunshine...

     

    As she has 3 of us she/we have to wait til my bro moves over - which is happening but no idea on timescales at the mo as hes committed to another 18mths work contract (and partner) in russia - he can transfer with his job over here - once hes seen out the contract in russia - it'll take as long for him to get a perm visa on his own so hes taking the easier route of getting work to fund it.

    So mum has to travel around until hes sorted...and keep hoping that ozzie immigration keep letting her in.

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    Gollywobbler is definately the person to contact - she knows everything there is to know about parent migration :notworthy::notworthy:

     

    My mum is over on a holiday visa - her 2nd - she came over last year, 1 yr tourist visa valid for 6mth stays, she stayed for 2 6mth stints, this year the visas changed and she has another 1 yr tourists visa but has to go off shore every 3 mths (ouch)...

    so shes off to bali in june for a bit of sunshine...

     

    As she has 3 of us she/we have to wait til my bro moves over - which is happening but no idea on timescales at the mo as hes committed to another 18mths work contract (and partner) in russia - he can transfer with his job over here - once hes seen out the contract in russia - it'll take as long for him to get a perm visa on his own so hes taking the easier route of getting work to fund it.

    So mum has to travel around until hes sorted...and keep hoping that ozzie immigration keep letting her in.

     

    Goodness - I have SO much respect for your Mum and all that to-ing and fro-ing! What a courageous lady she must be. I wish Chris' parents had this option but alas their mobility issues wouldn't allow it.

    Thanks for sharing your experiences. At least you know that eventually all should work out ok, depending on the ever changing DIAC that is!

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    Guest mimasawrus

    Hi ya

     

    I hope Gollywobbler can help you, with your questions. My mum is coming over again in may/june and is going to continue to make regular visits until we can sponsor her. So I hope it works out for you.

     

    Good Luck

     

    Laura x

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    I know there are a fair few of us on here who have or want our parents to move out to be near us and their grandchildren.

     

    I'm keen to hear your stories as my Inlaws are excited at the prospect of us sponsoring them to come out once we get PR. The problem is that I think they probably wouldn't pass the balance of family criteria as my FIL has 4 children from a previous marriage. Plus they both have health issues. FIL is elderly (aged 86) with diabetes and a dodgy hip and MIL, who is in her early 60s, has just had her second knee replacement, has had two hip replacements due to arthritis, has thyroid probs, is severely overweight, and has an irregular heart beat etc. She is taking a fair chunk of medication too.

     

    So what we're wondering is if there is any way they could come out as temp visa holders and simply renew whilst onshore. I have heard all sorts of stories and recently met an Irish lady who didn't pass the balance of family test but has been here for 9 years on a 4 year temp visa that she renews onshore and has settled in to a home that she had built here too. She has to have full medical insurance because there is no reciprocal agreement between Ireland and Australia. Would our relatives be entitled to reciprocal health care if here on a temp visa?

     

    I'd be grateful to anyone who can share their ideas/experiences as we're keen to help my Inlaws plan for their future.

     

    Thanks :wacko:

     

    Hi Odette

     

    It does not sound as if your in-laws would pass the Balance of Family Test at the momnt, because of the children from F-i-L's first marriage? However I note that he is considerably older than M-i-L. If she were a widow, her step-children would become irrelevant (exactly the same situation affected my own mother.) Would M=i=L be OK on the Balance of Family Test if she should be widowed in the future?

     

    At the moment the issue with Parents and meds is that they are subject to Public Interest Criterion 4005. What this means is that if the Parent is likely to cost the Aussie Government more than about $21,000 in health and community care during the Parents first 5 years in Oz, the Medical Officer of the Commonwealth is required to say that this would be a "significant cost" and to find that the Parent does not meet the Health requirement for migration.

     

    Taking several different drugs is irrelevant. Most drugs are very cheap because there is no patent protection on the drugs. Even when there is patent protection, the patents only last for about 5 years or so whilst the drug is very new. The Courts in the USA have an inherent dislike of patents because they interfere with open market competition. The Courts in the EU are headed the same way, I suspect. DIAC's Chief Medical Officer accepts that he can't say that someone "does not meet" PIC 4005 during 2010 because of the cost of the person's drugs when, for all that the CMO knows - or can be bothered to find out via asking some specialists - the drug might be no more expensive than aspirin by 2011 or 2012.

     

    The health requirement for migration to Oz is enjoying a long over-due shake-up at present. As part of that, DIAC suddenly want to increase the threshold of $21,000 to $100,000. DIAC admit that the present threshold was set in the late 1990s, has never been revisited because nobody could be bothered to revisit is and so it is now hopelessly out of date. DIAC reckon that the Minister for Immi will agree to their proposed new threshold of $100,000.

     

    http://www.aph.gov.au/house/committee/mig/disability/index.htm

     

    The migration legislation makes no distinction between a disability (eg an inability to walk) and a medical condition such as diabetes, so it is impossibe for the Joint Standing Committee to try to treat disability differently from any other condition which might give rise to the deemed "significant cost."

     

    If it becomes possible for your M-i-L to move to Oz permanently at some time in the future, she might well benefit from a relaxation of the draconian effects of a costs threshold which is unrealistically low. Therefore I wouldn't be too worried about hear health issues for the time being.

     

    I have heard all sorts of stories and recently met an Irish lady who didn't pass the balance of family test but has been here for 9 years on a 4 year temp visa that she renews onshore and has settled in to a home that she had built here too.

    The lady is in Oz on the 4-year, renewable Retirement Visa subclass 401 by the sounds of it. I think that it is believed that there are about 8,000 sc 410 holders in Oz and I think that about 5,000 of them belong to BERIA 410:

     

    BERIA 410 - HOME PAGE & NEWS

     

    She has to have full medical insurance because there is no reciprocal agreement between Ireland and Australia.

    I think that somebody is mistaken. Reciprocal Health Care Agreements are dealt with in the link below:

     

    Visitors to Australia - Medicare Australia

     

    The sc 410 visa itself prohibits access to Medicare and the PBS if the sc 410 visa was granted after December 1998. The visa conditions require the sc 410 visa holder to have private health insurance in Oz instead. Until about March 2008, the premiums wre not too bad for Temporary Residents in Oz, which is what sc 410 Holders are. However something to do with the legisation for private health insurance was then changed and private health insurance for people who do not have PR is now ferociously expensive according to BERIA 410's article in The Oldie (the link is on their website.) BERIA say that the present cost is about $6,000 AUD a year for a couple who are both aged 65. Apparently that hefty premium does not include expensive and potentially life prolonging drugs such as Tamoxifen, which is quite new, is still patent protected and is still very expensive as a result.

     

    The sc 410 Retirement visa can be renewed every 4 years. However the visa was closed to new applicants on 1st Huly 2005. From that date, it is now only possible to obtain the new subclass 405 Investor Retirement visa instead:

     

    Investor Retirement (Subclass 405)

     

    When Parents can afford an Investor Retirement visa, it is worth considering it. Most Parents can't afford it though.

     

    Cheers

     

    Gill

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    Guest katsmajic

    Thanks Gill, :notworthy:

    knew you'd have the answers.

     

    My mums a spring chicken at 55 so no retiring for her....

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    Guest Roo1

    Gill, you are amazing :notworthy:

     

    This wonderful lady helped my parents out by providing invaluable advice over a year ago now. They now have PR status here in Adelaide and loving life down under.

    If you would like any advice about contributary parent visa, pm Grandad on here.

     

    Judi x

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    Gill - Thank you so much for your expertise and excellent advice. I am so grateful to you for taking the time to help out. I am in awe of your knowledge and am sure I'm not alone in this regard.

     

    And I do hope the medical costs threshold increases...that would certainly help our MIL's case as she does have some serious health issues - having said that she manages to get by in the UK with very little input from the NHS, although she takes a lot of medication.

     

    So - I think for us the only viable option will be to support MIL for the contributory category visa once she is alone - horrible to contemplate FIL no longer being with us though :(

     

    Thanks again Gill and to everyone else who's shared their experiences.

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    Thanks Gill, :notworthy:

    knew you'd have the answers.

     

    My mums a spring chicken at 55 so no retiring for her....

     

    Hi Katsmajic

     

    Your Mum. Something odd is going on with her visa, I reckon. The visa that she ought to have is the subclass 676 Tourist Visa for Oz:

     

    Tourist Visa (Subclass 676)

     

    That is the most expensive of the Tourtst/Visitor visas. It costs over $100 AUD if you buy it from outside Australia.

     

    Your mother is British and she is only 55 years old. She is eligible for the subclass 651 e-visitor visa as well, which is completely free and allows the holder to make multiple entries to Oz and to spend up to 90 days in Oz during each visit. The sc 651 is completely free and you can get them on-line at home from any home PC in the UK. (The DIAC computer somehow knows where the applicant's computer is and the DIAC computer causes a home PC to default to the on-line form for the sc 651 visa because it is programmed to assume that the free, short stay e-visitor visa is the one that someone in the UK is likely to want.)

     

    eVisitor

     

    Travel agents and airlines can get subclass 976 ETAs on-line as well:

     

    ETA (Visitor) (Subclass 976)

     

    I think that the first thing with your Mum is to sort out which visa she actually has. DIAC's atttude has hardened in recent months but the visitor visas themselves have not changed.

     

    If your Mum really does have a subclass 676 visa, where was it obtained and was it obtained via a paper & post application to London or did she get it somewhere else or on-line, please? I can't understand why a British woman of 55 should only have been allowed a stay of 90 days max in Australia during each visit?

     

    If Mum does not have a sc 676 Tourist Visa, it might be well be worth your while to go to Currie Street and get a sc 676 Tourist Visa quite soon. It would cancel any other visa that your Mum might already hold. It costs over $200 to do this once the person is in Oz but it is still cheaper than sending the Parent to some other country:

     

    Tourists - Visitors - Visas & Immigration

     

    A situation in which Mum leaves Oz every 3 months is too expensive and is not acceptable in my opinion. If she has a sc 676 visa but someone has made a clerical mistake so that it only allows 90 day stays in Oz, I suspect that the solution is to ask DIAC to cancel the existing sc 676 and to grant a new one that permits sensible periods of stay. For $200, I expect more than 3 months at a stretch, frankly.

     

    However, in view of your family's situation - and the risk that a better sc 676 visa would also attract Condition 8503 - I would not go rushing to Currie Street just yet. I would consider the other alternatives as well for and with your Mamma first!

     

    Can Mum afford a subclass 405 Investor Retirement visa?

     

    Investor Retirement (Subclass 405)

     

    If she could afford a minimum of $1 million AUD and she has the necessary $50K AUD a year of minimum income, $500K of the capital is the Designated Investment. The capital must be invested with the State Treasury of SA as I understand it.

     

    Investor Retirement (subclass 405) visa

     

    The link above is for QUEENSLAND! However you can get similar information from Immigration SA:

     

    http://www.safa.sa.gov.au/documents/migration_bonds/infopaper_investor_retirement_visa.pdf

     

    http://safa-test.australis.net.au/documents/migration_bonds/infopaper_investor_retirement_visa.pdf

     

    The second link above says that Nigel Harvey is the guy who can say what sort of yield SAFA are offering on the Designated Investment at the moment, so if the visa is viable, I would phone him and ask him what the current interest rate is. I believe that interest rates in Oz are quite high at the moment but the Sterling/AUD exchange rate is so lousy (and likely to fall further in the event of a hung parliament according to Ken Clarke) that the sc 405 might not be a good visa to choose at the moment.

     

    The other possibility for your Mum would be a Student Visa. If she is willing to invest 20 hours a week in face-to-face study during the college terms, DIAC will enable her to do paid work during the other 20 hours a week during each term and they will enable her to work for unlimited hours during the college vacations. She could work at whatever she likes - Mum does not need to study in Oz as a potential route to Permanent Resdency in Oz, so in her shoes I'd be looking for a job where the pay is reasonable instead of earning apprentice rates in a job where the practical learning experience is relevant to whatever subject Mum might have chosen to study. Student Visa holders are not required to leave Oz during the period of the Student Visa so that bit is solely down to whether the student wishes to leave Oz during that time.

     

    If I were considering this idea for your Mum, I would start by considering which of the local TAFE colleges is nearby and what subjects she would be allowed to choose from if she became an International Student at the TAFE college concerned. They can all teach a much wider range of subjects to their local, Domestic Students, than they are allowed to teach to their International Students.

     

    TAFE South Australia: International

     

    Mum would be forced to choose one of the subjects that they are allowed to teach to International Students but which subject would be irrelevant for all other purposes because Mum would not be trying to follow the Student Visa Trail into becoming a Permanent Resident in Oz later on. A CPV would do that bit for her instead.

     

    Therefore if your Mum finds this possibility attractive, I reckon that the first step is to work out which subject she might like to study and would be able to study at the TAFE college which would be the most convenient for her.

     

    That bit narrowed down to some sensible parameters, the next step is a chat with the relevant TAFE. I'd arrange to go and see whoever teaches the relevant course. The staff at the TAFEs are paid by the Government of SA because the State Government owns the TAFEs. The staff can be amazingly generous with the State Government's money when they hear about the staggering costs of a Contributory Parent visa and the fact that it is not possible for the relevant Parent even to apply for a CPV as yet but the costs of getting CPVs increase on 1st July every year without fail.

     

    A Student Visa for your Mum would defray some of the costs whilst she waits, by enabling her to do some paid work, and it would also prevent her from being forced to take several holidays outside Australia.

     

    The TAFE staff cannot be forced to be generous about what fees the TAFE would charge for an "International Student" in your mother's situation. However I have heard of situations where, when the British Parent has explained the costs and the problem to them, the relevant TAFE staff have agreed to charge the Parent no more than the ordinary Domestic Student rate for the course.... They can't be forced to offer this concession but if you don't talk to them and explain your own difficulties to them, the staff will not have the chance to consider whether there is anything that they can do in order to help out.

     

    The TAFE are the only people I would talk with about your Mum - unless she is a candidate for a course at the local Uni? The Uni courses cost more than the TAFE courses so please bear this in mind. Some TAFEs now offer Advanced Diplomas. These are AQF Diplomas and they take at least 2 years (might be 3 years for some subjects.)

     

    There are several privately-owned tertiary education colleges in Adelaide. They are aimed at teaching International Students but the College is supposed to earn a profit for the commercial investor who owns it, so I can't see those colleges being willing to offer a reduced fee. They would insist that the idea is "impossible." It is not impossible, but I can understand why the staff of a TAFE are more likely to be generous about this.

     

    However using a Student Visa in the way that I describe is not an unusual tactic for a British Parent in your Mum's situation to choose. The visas allow for it and the visas are not fussed about the fees paid or the subjects studied as long as the college can arrange for an International Student to study the subject, so the whole of the practical bit would depend on on what you and your Mum could arrange locally if the idea appeals. The visa merely follows on from the practical decisions and there is no upper age limit for Student visas. The visas themselves are quite cheap and easy to deal with on your own. 55 is not too old for a course, either.

     

    Cheers

     

    Gill

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    Gill, you are amazing :notworthy:

     

    This wonderful lady helped my parents out by providing invaluable advice over a year ago now. They now have PR status here in Adelaide and loving life down under.

    If you would like any advice about contributary parent visa, pm Grandad on here.

     

    Judi x

     

    Hi Judi

     

    Thanks for your kind words above. Please tell your Parents that I do have it in mind to e-mail them as soon as I can but work is hectic at the moment, as is dealing with people's problems with visas during my spare time.

     

    I agree with you. Grandad knows exactly what he is doing with both the long stay sc 676 Tourist visa and with Contributory Parent visas. For the child in Adelaide, contacting Grandad would be easy and he can definitely help to steer the Parents who are following on behind him in the right directions and generally keep them out of trouble. His user profile is here:

     

    Poms In Adelaide - View Profile: grandad

     

    Cheers

     

    Gill

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    Hi again, Odette

     

    Don't worry about the cost of M-i-L's drugs. When my mother applied for her CPV in 2005, I agreed with the Parents Visa Centre that we would frontload Mum's CPV visa meds. Mum is in a wheelchair after breaking her back a few years ago. My sister in Oz was all Doom & Gloom about whether Mum would get through the meds for PR in Australia. My sister's information was all anecdotal horror stories that she "had heard" from other people in Oz. I researched the whole subject thoroughly and properly from the UK and as far as I could see, Mum would not be likely to have a problem with her visa meds, though that belief wasn't a certainty, admittedly.

     

    Because we decided to frontload Mum's visa meds, I completed Mum's Form 26 for the local Panel Doctor. It requires you to list all the drugs so I got Mum's small carrier bag full of drugs. I knew that she has a lot of minor ailments - she is now 89 and was 84 at the time. However none of the ailments are life-threatening, even though all of them are chronic conditions, mostly associated with her age, and all of them are alleviated by pills it would seem.

     

    I sat at the dining table and sorted out the drugs into piles. There were 13 different drugs that Mum has to take every day. She was vague about which condition is dealt with by which drug and I didn't know, so I decided just to list all the drugs and leave the Panel Doctor to figure out what each one is for.

     

    Nobody even commented on the number or price of Mum's drugs. Mobility is the only major problem that Mum has. Mum's history is that she broke her back in the UK in 1996, when she was 76. She then broke her hip in 1980, in Australia.

     

    The Panel Doctor asked whether Mum's back-injury prevented her from shuffling more than a few yards on her zimmer frame or whether her hip had caused that? Mum and I confirmed that we noticed the mobility problem and dealt with it when Mum had broken her back. Breaking her hip and needing an emergency operation for a new hip hasn't caused any long term physical problems, we reckon.

     

    The hospital doctors in the UK said that Mum would make a "complete recovery" from breaking her back. That didn't happen. Mum couldn't walk properly. So I thumped the table. Much against the wishes of Mum's GP, I might add. I dragged the information out of him that the only specialist for an injury like Mum's is a neuro-surgeon. However sending Mum to one would be a waste of time because although a neuro-surgeon would know what to do, he would not agree to operate to try to cure Mum.

     

    I told the GP to refer Mum to a neuro-surgeon and to make a private referral so that we would see him quickly. The surgeon confirmed that he would not be prepared to try to do the necessary operation but he arranged several scans and he provided a specialist's report, explaining the exact medical problem in detail. He then sent Mum to a pain specialist, to try to deal with the pain in her legs because that stems from her back injury.

     

    I produced the neuro-surgeon's report to the Panel Doctor. He said that that particular problem can sometimes shift. (A peice of Mum's vertebra sheered off and is pressing into her spinal chord, causing all the other problems.) The local Panel Doctor was excellent. He said that the wedge shaped piece of bone might have moved and that it would definitely be possible to find out whether it had moved, whether anything could be done 9 years later etc.

     

    However he decided to send a copy of the specialist's report to the Medical Officer of the Commonwealth in Oz and to ask the MOC whether the latter wanted us to get another neuro-surgeon involved with Mum etc?

     

    The MOC showed no interest in whether or not Mum should see another neuro-surgeon. The MOC wanted Mum to be examined by a Consultant Geriatrician instead. Mum left the UK and went back to Oz soon after I applied for her CPV, so her GP in Oz had to arrange for Mum to see a Geriatrician in Perth. He and the Panel Doctor both said that sending Mum to a Geriatrician was a total waste of money and a total waste of everyone's time. Both GPs harrumphed that if a Geriatrician would be a suitable specialist for Mum to see, they would have organised it without waiting for a prompt from the MOC.

     

    However the MOC had demanded this total waste of time and money, so it was arranged. The MOC had 5 questions for the Geriatrician. They were:

     

    1. Was Mum OK mentally?

     

    2. How independent was she able to be in Activities of Daily Living? (In the UK, they use 4 specific tests to determine this. In Oz they use 5 tests. The Aussies ask the additional question of whether the person can climb stairs. God knows why Bungalowsville asks that question in a country that hardly passesses a staircase but the issue is ignored in the UK! Mum can't climb stairs any more but she was also 85 at the time, so what turns on whether or not she can climb Australian Stairs, fer gawd's sake????!!)

     

    3. What was Mum's general health like apart from her mobility problems?

     

    4. Would Mum be likely to need residential care either then or in the "fioreseeable future"?

     

    5. Was Mum able to make the long journey to Oz on her own and by air?

     

    Mum was already in Oz. She had arrived there three weeks before the MOC's request arrived. She was fine so plainly she could get to the place and she had flown from the UK on her own.

     

    The killer question was the fourth one. Everything I had read and continued to read about Residential Care in Oz says that whether or not the person needs Residential Care is largely irrelevant. Whether or not the person needs Residential Care, Australia looks at whether Family Support is available instead. If the person can stay in the community with the assistance of other members of the family, there ain't no way that the Australian Government will agree to a place in a Govt-funded Care Home instead.

     

    We had just learned all about the brutal way that the Aussies treat the elderly in Oz. My sister is married to an Aussie called Neil. His Aussie mother, Fay, was widowed and lived on her own. She had had Legionnaire's Disease, which produced ulcers on her legs, so her legs were bandaged. Fay had been cold one afternoon in winter in Perth, so she had pulled her armchair close to the electric fire in her house in Perth. Fay had then fallen asleep. My sister Elaine happened to call round to make sure that Fay was OK. She got there to find that the bandages were smouldering and threatening to catch fire.

     

    Elaine pulled out the plug for the electric fire. Then she moved Fay's armachair out of the way. Then she doused the old lady's bandages with a bucket of water to prevent any possible fire. She then spent an hour trying to get the local Social Services people on the phone. She told them that the situation was very dangerous and that they must send somebody to Fay's house immediately. They said they would.

     

    Fay died 3 months later. Nobody from Social Services had visited her. They simply left everything to my sister Elaine. Somebody who might set fire to themselves plainly needs to be in a Care Home. However I assume that Fay's daughter in law Elaine was deemed to be providing Family Support because Social Services did not lift a finger for Fay. I don't know what the rules are in the UK but the Aussies say that the equivalent system is totally hopeless in Oz. I believe them.

     

    The theory in Oz (according to the DoHA website) is that if somebody raises the alarm. an Aged Care Assessment Team will visit the patient at home. A Consultant Geriatrican is in charge of every ACATs team. If the Geriatrician decides that the person should go into a Care Home then that is arranged according to the vision of Utopia described by DoHA. In practice, it does not happen. I reckon that the GPs probably have to make a huge fuss to Social Services in order to get anything done. I reckon that the family member who phones Social Services is deemed to be providing Family Support, in which case Social Services will listen politely but that this is all they will do, too.

     

    So - when I know for a fact that the Aged Care system in Oz does not work but the MOC will rely on the Aussie Government's completely unrealistic visions of Utopia - what was the Consultant Geriatrician going to say about Q4?

     

    In his report, he told the MOC firmly that when someone is 85, it is impossible to predict whether they will even be alive in a week's time, so the question of whether they might need Residential Care in a week's time is a stupid question to ask and that the "foreseeable future" is the next 48 hours only. Mum has stacks of Family Support, so there is no way that the Geriatrician would have sent Mum to a Care Home anyway, plus she needs to be with her family, in the community, in a proper family home. The Geriatrician told the MOC that there was no need to do anything except give Mum har own way at the time, but that if she should suffer another fracture, the shock of the fracture would probably kill her before anyone else could do anything about anything else. One would just have to wait and see whether it happens and deal with whatever the situation would be at the relevant time, he insisted.

     

    The MOC accepted what the Geriatrician said, and there was no reason for refusing Mum's CPV at the time. So Mum was given unconditional medical clearance for a visa for Oz.

     

    Every person's case differs from the next person's. However I don't think you want to be too pessimistic about your M-i-L's health. I think that DIAC will increase the threshold to the $100K that they say they want. I don't think that the current Minister for Immi would do anything except agree to the increase from $21,000.

     

    Do your in-laws have any plans to visit you in Oz? If so, please shout.

     

    Cheers

     

    Gill

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    I would like to say a massive thank you to Gill for her amazingly informative posts. This has had great relevance to us today and has (I think) helped resolve a recent issue which was concerning us.

     

    My OH had a long conversation with his mother today and after swinging between not speaking to us, visiting with complete disinterest and phoning to have a go at us for the past two and a half years she has finally begun to calm down! To be fair the timing of our migration was dreadful as her husband (OH's step-father) died two months after we arrived, so she dealt with two enormous losses close together.

     

    Anyway, after this conversation she has begun to consider the possibility of moving out here to be near us, however she has three step-children from her second marriage (OH also has a brother living in Spain, but this wouldn't negatively afffect the BoF). Thankfully it seems from the post above that now she is widowed, these step-children are no longer counted against her - this is such a relief as they are all 40ish and have no relationship with her, so for them to have affected her future would have been horrendous.

     

    We may need lots of information if she does decide to go down this route - at the moment she has now agreed to come for Xmas and have a more objective look around - I think it would be the apv as she is only 66 and in pretty reasonable health so an 8-10 year wait would potentially be okay.

     

    It's great to get the advice you really need - this site and some of its members have been an invaluable help to us on many occasions - thank you. :notworthy::notworthy:

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    Hi Beanbear

     

    Anyway, after this conversation she has begun to consider the possibility of moving out here to be near us, however she has three step-children from her second marriage (OH also has a brother living in Spain, but this wouldn't negatively afffect the BoF). Thankfully it seems from the post above that now she is widowed, these step-children are no longer counted against her - this is such a relief as they are all 40ish and have no relationship with her, so for them to have affected her future would have been horrendous.

     

    Now that your M-i-L is a widow, her step-children definitely have ZERO effect on the Balance of Family Test.

     

    I sorted this question out in 2005 on behalf of my own mother, so I am definitely right about how the law works. My mother was getting on and she desperately wanted PR in Australia. Dad died in 1991. At the time, Dad had 3 daughters - one from his first marriage to his first wife and 2 from his second marriage to Mum, My younger sister has lived in Oz since she was 21. I and my half-suster (17 years older than me) have always lived in the UK. Mum and Dad lived in the UK as well.

     

    The rest is a very long story. However what is boils down to is do not trust a migration agent to tell you what the Law is about this, because nearly all of them are wrong about it. Talk to DIAC instead, via parents@immi.gov.au They reply very quickly. do not charge a bean and their Law is correct and can be trusted.

     

    The only migration agent that I have ever come across who knows anything about this peculiar piece of Law is Tony Coates:

     

    PomsInOz Forum

     

    However there is no real need to bother with a migration agent for Parent migration in any case. You are clearly not too thick to help your M-i-L do the boring form-filling, which is all that it actually is.

     

    The Xu case is also relevant to you, as it was to me:

     

    Xu, Sheng Lau [2003] MRTA 5061 (14 July 2003)

     

    You don't actually have to quote that case to DIAC. As a matter of Policy, DIAC admit that the arguments in the Xu case are correct, legally.

     

    Peter Bollard acted for Mrs Xu. However he now says that he cannot remember anything about the relevant Law - which seems odd to me!

     

    Peter Bollard & Associates

     

    Perhaps practicing Law in a shrubbery confuses his mind? It would certainly confuse mine!

     

    Cheers

     

    Gill

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    Guest katsmajic

    Thanks Gill, student visa, thats a great :idea: it'll do my mum good to get the grey matter working....

     

    The courses available are pretty extensive so shes got a fair bit of choice and we have the benefit that i know a few of the lecturers in some of the subjects.

     

    In your debt :notworthy:

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    Gill - Thanks again for your long post and for taking the time to share your experiences.

    My Inlaws came out for a holiday last year and will not be coming again until MIL tries to move out - simply too expensive and stressful for them both to manage it.

     

    MIL is taking many drugs and has lots of health probs for her age (she's 64 this year) so who knows how that will be seen by the medics. She was once told by a GP that her body appears to be 20 years older than her actual age. Do you think this would affect the application?

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    Hi Beanbear

     

     

    However there is no real need to bother with a migration agent for Parent migration in any case. You are clearly not too thick to help your M-i-L do the boring form-filling, which is all that it actually is.

     

    The Xu case is also relevant to you, as it was to me:

     

    Xu, Sheng Lau [2003] MRTA 5061 (14 July 2003)

     

    You don't actually have to quote that case to DIAC. As a matter of Policy, DIAC admit that the arguments in the Xu case are correct, legally.

     

    Peter Bollard acted for Mrs Xu. However he now says that he cannot remember anything about the relevant Law - which seems odd to me!

     

    Peter Bollard & Associates

     

    Perhaps practicing Law in a shrubbery confuses his mind? It would certainly confuse mine!

     

    Cheers

     

    Gill

     

    Hi Gill,

     

    Looked at the Lau case mentioned above (not that I doubted your wisdom on this matter!) and it was presented exactly as you said. As I say a real relief.

     

    MIL has now accepted an offer on her house in the UK - Herts seems to be enjoying a very bouyant market, fortunately for her. We now have to decide exactly which option she should go for - either the apv or cpv.

     

    If it was to be the latter, is the process started in the UK or would you come over and attempt to get the temporary cpv first before applying for the pr one? Would the temporary one enable her to buy property etc?

     

    I guess she will have to come for a visit and make a final decision, it's just thinking about what she should do when she becomes homeless (if her sale all goes through!)

     

    So, what should the next step be do you think?

     

    Thanks in anticipation..:notworthy::)

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