Jessica Berry

Today Tonight - Poms returning to UK

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    Did anyone see the story on Today Tonight about the poms in Perth going back to the UK and handing back their Australian citizenship?

     

    What surprised me were the figures they were quoting. According to Today Tonight in the last financial year 15,555 people emigrated from the UK to Australia, but in the same financial year 7,127 british migrants permanently left Australia. They then did a comparison with Indian migration and 15,626 Indians migrated to Australia in the same financial year but only 849 returned to India.

     

    I know they usually quote one third who emigrate from the UK to Australia return back to the UK, but on those figures you are looking at nearly half returning back to the UK.

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    Guest shella_n

    Someone at work was talking about this today and we ended up having quite a discussion about it. I've seen so many people go home for such a wide range of reasons - can't get jobs, not what they expected, miss family etc etc - u just don't know when u board that plane how it's going to turn out for you.

     

    For us it's worked out well and we have no plans to go hone - but never say never - who knows what the future will bring.

     

    I think one of themajor problems facing those who are about to arrive is thd job situation - and I hate to say it but I believe that a higher number of people than usual will end up going home cause they can't get work.

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    It's more difficult for an Indian person to return to India if they are an Australian citizen, as they have to renounce their Indian citizenship once they get Aussie citizenship, and therefore have to apply to return to India as a migrant!

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    Things fall apart for different people for different reasons.

    If you dont go you will never know.

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    I agree about the jobs, and unless some balance can be struck in the 'two speed' Aus economy I can't see it changing soon.

     

    Also, it's interesting to see how the discussion about cost of living between Aus and UK has changed over the last seven or eight years. When we were first considering making the move, Australia was undoubtedly considerably cheaper on just about every front, and a commonly aired dilemma was whether to live mortgage free or go for the really big house and take out a small mortgage ...

     

    Jim

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    Guest Guest5035

    still is cheap if you earn alot, but expensive if you don't, also years ago there was no mobile plans, foxtel, internet connections etc etc. Do we really need them?? Takeaway those costs on a weekly basis....we have just sold a car as we do not need it now, so theres a big yearly saving

     

    stevo

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    Guest m.jephcott

    When we first moved to Australia in 2004 I was told that around 50% of new migrants would return to the UK within the first year and that of these 50% would return to Australia, I don't know how many of these then stay on permanently. I was also told that around 30% of couples married or otherwise would split up in the first year ( not sure I believe that one).

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    still is cheap if you earn alot, but expensive if you don't, also years ago there was no mobile plans, foxtel, internet connections etc etc. Do we really need them?? Takeaway those costs on a weekly basis....we have just sold a car as we do not need it now, so theres a big yearly saving

     

    stevo

     

    Well that's the same the world over, but I'm talking about cheap in comparison to another place. Obviously people can cut back on things they don't need; nothing new there or specific to why more UK migrants are going back to the UK (if they are, I haven't seen any figures on this).

     

    I do think that sometimes the aspirations/expectations of some migrants are partly based on the experiences of those who have gone before them, and when the reality they face on moving proves to be very different to these expectations it can be a jolt. Certainly I know people back in the UK who still believe it's massively cheaper in Aus because of family members' experiences from moving 15 or 20 years ago. Their 'mental map' of the place hasn't kept pace with how things have changed.

     

    Jim

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    this topic came up in work at our place today, too.

    One guy, a tradey, was saying it was really hard to get work on building sites, and even the guys who do houseframing where being told to "take their time"!

    He actually said the english get the hardest time of it; and are often the first to get "laid off"; im not sure how true this is, but he's an ozzy in the "know", i suppose! He himself was over in QLD, and the situation there is even worse, despite the recent weather disasters.

     

    It's a shame these people are leaving, the story was a bit slanted though, surely ANY council would be the same to ozzies or anyone else, same as in the uk!

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    I can't believe that bloke renounced his Aussie citizenship. How dumb can you get? To throw away all your chances of ever returning here to live just shows him to be a bloody minded idiot. I wonder if he acted in such a petulant manner whilst dealing with his local council. I reckon he dug his own hole and is now complaining because he's in it. Sod him.

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    When we first moved to Australia in 2004 I was told that around 50% of new migrants would return to the UK within the first year and that of these 50% would return to Australia, I don't know how many of these then stay on permanently. I was also told that around 30% of couples married or otherwise would split up in the first year ( not sure I believe that one).

     

     

    Some friends returned to the UK after living in Australia for 6 years and then split up about 1 year after returning to live in the UK. Returning to live in the UK made it easier for my friend to leave her husband as they had 2 kids and even though they had not lived in the UK for 6 years she was given a house to live in and could claim all the benefits.

     

    I think if you have a rocky relationship to start with migrating will not necessarily help, especially if you struggle to get work and money is tight.

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    Guest guest569

    maybe the rest of the Indians that left Oz and didn't go back to India decided to go and see their relatives in the Uk ????

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    still is cheap if you earn alot, but expensive if you don't, also years ago there was no mobile plans, foxtel, internet connections etc etc. Do we really need them?? Takeaway those costs on a weekly basis....we have just sold a car as we do not need it now, so theres a big yearly saving

     

    stevo

     

    Whether something is cheap or expensive is to do with comparative costs not income.

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    Guest James

    The reality is that people emigrating now are in a tougher position becauese the pound has collapsed in value against the dollar, in two years the value has dropped by 40% that is a big difference. So whatever you bring is worth much less. When you emigrate you have to start again which costs loads anyway. a new fridge, beds etc unless you rent furnished which is also expensive here.

     

    It is virtually impossible to compare standards of living and cost of living. I find I earn significantly more in Australia , tax is similar but includes no state pension ( as there is none in Australia), food is on the whole 50% dearer, on returning to Engalnd, Waitrose yes Waitrose seemed bargain price. Housing cost is similar I think. Until recently I am sure most English people had a higher material standard of living ( not necessarily quality of life), foxtel is not nearly as common as skye, foreign holidays are much rarer here ( it is further to get anywhere). Cars are much dearer due to tax a Mini starting at $36000 as opposed to about $20,000 in UK and petrol is catching up with English prices. Road tax is double or triple UK levels, ok no MOT but not sure that is a good thing. New kitchens and furniture seem much less common to me.\

     

    I think for all you are paid extra, there are extra costs here so it is the same in the end but you can not under-estimate the cost of emigrating. In the end i think this is the reason a lot of people go back they can not afford it now. Nor can tehy get the dream hous ethey hoped as it is not significantly cheaper than much of England

     

    It probably used to take most people 5 years to recoup the cost of emigrating and setting up in a new county now I expect it is 10 to get back to where you started due to the change in exchange rate. The type of visa makes a big difference too, until recently I was entitled to nothing which makes a difference when everyone else has centrelink payments and full Medicare rights etc month on month. If you can not get a job or only one of you works you are in a very difficult position here.

     

    Let's face it also going back to India is different to going back to England so perhaps us English guys have more choice

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    I think James has made some valid points, however Minis here re seen as trendy imported cars and like all "luxury" cars have a high import tax put on them. A good entry level car here can be bought for around $20000. These tend to be Fords and Holdens made here and also Japanese cars. Also there is a state pension, it is means tested and is reduced depending on how much dough you have when you retire and also assets. If you work here then your employer has to pay 9% of what you earn into a superannuation fund for you for your retirement, in to which you can also put money. It is probably harder to get a foot in the door here than in the way it used to be when the pound was doing a lot better. However migrants from other countries come here with dreams and manage to realise them, I suppose it depends on initial expectations.

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    still is cheap if you earn alot, but expensive if you don't, also years ago there was no mobile plans, foxtel, internet connections etc etc. Do we really need them?? Takeaway those costs on a weekly basis....we have just sold a car as we do not need it now, so theres a big yearly saving

     

    stevo

     

    Have to say we did that here in the UK a few years ago when our son was born. Got rid of our second car and went down to just the one and hubby started cycling (or running) the 9 miles to work. Has saved a small fortune and improved his fitness. Even I dusted off my bike, got a kid seat for it and now bike lots with my son rather than taking the car, at least locally.

     

    We also scaled back and don't have satellite TV. It costs £45 odd a month if you want one of the bigger packages with movies or sports. Who has time to watch all those channels anyways?! :eek: Not us :cute:

     

    We plan on being a one car family out in Adelaide also. And shall probably not bother with Foxtel or anything. Hopefully shall do the cycling thing there also to some degree.

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    Guest guest569
    Have to say we did that here in the UK a few years ago when our son was born. Got rid of our second car and went down to just the one and hubby started cycling (or running) the 9 miles to work. Has saved a small fortune and improved his fitness. Even I dusted off my bike, got a kid seat for it and now bike lots with my son rather than taking the car, at least locally.

     

    We also scaled back and don't have satellite TV. It costs £45 odd a month if you want one of the bigger packages with movies or sports. Who has time to watch all those channels anyways?! :eek: Not us :cute:

     

    We plan on being a one car family out in Adelaide also. And shall probably not bother with Foxtel or anything. Hopefully shall do the cycling thing there also to some degree.

    I'm not surprised you don't have time to watch movies or sports, your hubby must go straight to bed when he gets in after running 9 miles to and from work !!!! lol

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    Guest James

    We only have ine car but you will need to choose wher you live as public transport is here but not like in UK cities as my wife who does not drive will tell you. It is true Minis are luxury cars here so perhaps that was unfair but there again that is the point things that rae not deluxe in teh UK are here and yes you get a means tested pension but what are we paying so much tax for the same as teh UK where you all get the pension ( not that the UK can afford it) just some thoughts. I think when people come out they need to knwo the cost of living is very high and they will not necessrilly afford what they did in the UK and also that teh pensions are different and swopping systems in middle age as I have can lead to poverty in old age, one to think about

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    You can get your UK pension sent here, I think once you claim it though it doesn't get indexed anymore. It's a toughie for you James. Some people go back and forth until they finally settle here and it is usually the family that is the drawcard. It is hard to be away from all the family rituals etc that continue when you are not there. Adelaide is hard without a car unless you live very centrally or in the older nearer to city suburbs that are well served by transport. We had one car when our 3 children were little, but we lived very close to the city. If you are planning to live in Glenelg, then that would be ok as everything you need is within walking distance and the tram for the city. In summer there will be many hours when you will just not get on your bike and go down the road, even with sunscreen sloshed all over. It will be just too hot. Of course you will adapt your lifestyle and with one young child it is easier. Later you may find you need a second car as that sports match/ dance lesson or whatever after school will be at some school not within walking distance, or bike distance. Adelaide may be small in terms of population but it is spread out. I guess it depends on where your husband works too. Mine needed his for work.

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    .... you will need to choose wher you live as public transport is here but not like in UK cities as my wife who does not drive will tell you...

     

    Surely that is true about any country? When we lived in the UK the public transport was pants and we could never have coped without two cars. Here we live in a lovely suburb on the edge of the hills, which we specifically chose to live in so OH would be within cycling distance to where he would be working. He has since changed jobs but still cycles the 45 minute ride into work (in fact he gets grumpy if for any reason he has to drive instead but that's another story) and although I do drive to and from my work, if I was working in the city, I would definitely take the bus/O-Bahn as that's much quicker, cheaper and hassle free than driving.

     

    If you are moving from somewhere in the UK where you had good public transport, and one of you doesn't drive, then of course you'd look to live in a suburb here that had the same...... wouldn't you? Yes, it might mean getting a slightly smaller house to start with, or maybe not having a pool, but you make your choices sensibly according to your individual circumstances...don't you? There are plenty of places in Adelaide that are very well served by public transport.

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    I agree with Diane, it all depends where you live. On our road the bus stops are outside, the train is a 5 minute walk and the tram a 12 minute walk. When I lived in Nottingham my option was only to get the bus, so we have more public transport options here.

     

    We knew of a couple that moved out to Aldinga. The husband absolutely hated driving with a passion, he got a job in the Northern suburbs and it took him forever to get to work and in the meantime his wife was out at Aldinga with no car and on her own all day. They lasted 3 months in Adelaide and went back to the UK. Consider transport options when you look at a place to rent/buy.

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    Guest Barney Rubble
    I agree with Diane, it all depends where you live. On our road the bus stops are outside, the train is a 5 minute walk and the tram a 12 minute walk. When I lived in Nottingham my option was only to get the bus, so we have more public transport options here.

     

    We knew of a couple that moved out to Aldinga. The husband absolutely hated driving with a passion, he got a job in the Northern suburbs and it took him forever to get to work and in the meantime his wife was out at Aldinga with no car and on her own all day. They lasted 3 months in Adelaide and went back to the UK. Consider transport options when you look at a place to rent/buy.

     

     

    Call me harsh but to be honest i'd say that is just poor planning on their behalf.

    No logic in that what-so-ever. :nah:

     

    We stayed in Willaston (that's past Gawler for you Southerners :jiggy:) for 3 months (20+ years ago) then every weekend (and some evenings) went driving around the suburbs.

     

    Spent a lot of time 'down south' looking but eventually decided that if it was 30 minutes to drive to the beach that was a lot quicker than we had in the UK !

     

    Still in the same house now, put in a pool that is not used much (except this week :wubclub: ) and the O-Bahn stopped at Paradise then.

     

    Getting homesick, :skeptical:, i'd like to meet one person who could put their hand on their hearts and say they don't get homesick now and again, it is how you chose to solve it that is the deciding factor.

     

    That's my 2 bob's worth anyway:notworthy:

     

    Cheers

     

    BR

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    Guest Paula H
    Call me harsh but to be honest i'd say that is just poor planning on their behalf.

    No logic in that what-so-ever. :nah:

     

    We stayed in Willaston (that's past Gawler for you Southerners :jiggy:) for 3 months (20+ years ago) then every weekend (and some evenings) went driving around the suburbs.

     

    Spent a lot of time 'down south' looking but eventually decided that if it was 30 minutes to drive to the beach that was a lot quicker than we had in the UK !

     

    Still in the same house now, put in a pool that is not used much (except this week :wubclub: ) and the O-Bahn stopped at Paradise then.

     

    Getting homesick, :skeptical:, i'd like to meet one person who could put their hand on their hearts and say they don't get homesick now and again, it is how you chose to solve it that is the deciding factor.

     

    That's my 2 bob's worth anyway:notworthy:

     

    Cheers

     

    BR

     

    Excellent post BR

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