Misplaced

Urgent Info Needed - Please

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    Hi,

     

    As some of you will know I am an Aussie hoping to return to Oz in July 2012. However, there maybe a fly in the ointment and I would really appreciate peoples experience and or knowledge on the following: -

     

    Do employers in general in Australia require you to have a medical?

     

    Has anyone any experience of being refused employment due to something found during a medical?

     

    When applying for a job are you asked any medical questions? If so, what do they generally ask?

     

    In my line of work, IT Business Analyst, does anyone have any experience of being asked to have a medical?

     

    You may all be wondering why all the questions but as I have a number of medical problems and if employers in Australia are unwilling to take someone like me on then it is a no brainer about moving back. I also no there is the Fair Work Policy in Oz but I am not too sure how stringently this is applied and whether employers get round this, regularly.

     

    To those I have contacted privately I do not believe what you have told me but want to get a much wider view.

     

    Thanks,

     

    Mis

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    Guest Guest5035

    most jobs require a medical and now even a drug test, reason being, you could be carrying a injury and later decide to claim compo for something that wasn't the companies fault. re your it i would also think the same there..

     

    stevo

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    Not that I know the ins and outs but surely even if you have a medical, so long as you declare any pre existing conditions and so on and it won't affect your ability to do the actual job it shouldn't be a total disaster. Many people have some kind of medical condition these days be it a skin problem to asthma to taking pills to prevent something flaring up or occurring. Those people are still employable in many instances. Of course if you were not able to do specific things within the job spec it would be a different matter perhaps, ie, needing to lift on a regular basis and you have a bad back problem and cannot lift under doctors orders, that sort of thing. Or being blind in one eye would rule you out of driving a taxi, that sort of thing.

     

    I've had medicals here in the UK in the past. One job came with private medical insurance, so I declared my exisiting conditions, they were therefore not covered by the insurance and so on but it didn't affect my ability to do the job or anything. Spent a very happy 4.5 years in that one then :)

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    Guest Guest5035
    Not that I know the ins and outs but surely even if you have a medical, so long as you declare any pre existing conditions and so on and it won't affect your ability to do the actual job it shouldn't be a total disaster. Many people have some kind of medical condition these days be it a skin problem to asthma to taking pills to prevent something flaring up or occurring. Those people are still employable in many instances. Of course if you were not able to do specific things within the job spec it would be a different matter perhaps, ie, needing to lift on a regular basis and you have a bad back problem and cannot lift under doctors orders, that sort of thing. Or being blind in one eye would rule you out of driving a taxi, that sort of thing.

     

    I've had medicals here in the UK in the past. One job came with private medical insurance, so I declared my exisiting conditions, they were therefore not covered by the insurance and so on but it didn't affect my ability to do the job or anything. Spent a very happy 4.5 years in that one then :)

     

    I know a mate who went for a medical they found a Hernia...no job, another one who said he was 13% deaf in one ear...no job, one who had asthma..no job, it comes down not to whether you can do the job, but if you are going to be reliable, not off sick and claiming compo.

     

    stevo

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    I know a mate who went for a medical they found a Hernia...no job, another one who said he was 13% deaf in one ear...no job, one who had asthma..no job, it comes down not to whether you can do the job, but if you are going to be reliable, not off sick and claiming compo.

     

    stevo

     

    Stevo,

     

    That's the indications I am getting from different people.

     

    I know there is the Fair Work legislation in Oz but I get the feeling that an employer in Oz would steer well clear of employing someone with a medical condition, even if said medical condition(s) would not prevent them from carrying out the duties involved in the job. As you have said Stevo it is because of the perceived risk of more sick leave etc..

     

    It would be good to know though Stevo if the jobs your mates were turned down for were due to the medical condition and what jobs they had applied for?

     

    This really is a big issue for me and my family so as many views/opinions/experiences would be very much appreciated.

     

    Cheers,

     

    Mis

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    I find it strange that a person having asthma is overlooked for a job based purely on having it. I have it myself and its never been an issue for any employer here in the UK or overseas. It barely rates a mention tbh. I am off sick from work far less than the average and my employment record and references speak for themselves. 3.5 years in one job, 3 days off sick. 4.5 years in another job, 2 days off sick. Next employer sees that record and knows I am fit and well and able to do the job.

     

    I don't believe it is solely down to a person having asthma or some other condition that means they don't get a specific job, even if it won't effect their ability to do the job. Surely there are legal procedures in place to prevent this. Saying that, like companies who don't hire women of a certain age and marital status in case they get pregnant and go on maternity leave, it can be hard to prove why they overlook you.

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    Go for a government job if you can get it. They do ask you questions (or the couple I have worked for have) but as far as I know they don't require a medical, not for IT work, perhaps if you were a Doctor or Nurse. IMO I don't think it is anyone's business what your illness is in relation to you getting a job or not. You can tell them after you get the job so that if anything crops up then they know how they can help if you need it. They are not allowed to do it - it is discriminatory but in practice I think a lot of places are discriminatory so pick an area/industry that is less likely to do it (like government). No one wants their staff/workers to take sick leave but that is where the double standard comes into play.....it is ok when they do it. I've been fairly healthy for a long time but the last few years it's been one thing after another and then when your family gets ill too....it's really hard. It is our right to take time off when we are ill and I look around me and see that people go on maternity leave, they take days off because their children are sick or they have caught some bug from their child. Then people take a couple of weeks off with neck and back problems. These are genuine people, terrific workers too but it happens.

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    Guest Guest5035

     

     

     

    It would be good to know though Stevo if the jobs your mates were turned down for were due to the medical condition and what jobs they had applied for?

     

     

    one was a fitter going for another fitters job, (hernia, after his op he rang them up and was told no job failed medical) asthma as below and that was the reason given to him..hearing, told he might not hear forklift horn or other alarms ie fire etc etc.

     

     

     

    I find it strange that a person having asthma is overlooked for a job based purely on having it.

    believe me it happens, if a employee has a severe attack, which in turn leads to more serious implications, then theres alot of paperwork etc etc etc to be done, along with a employee off work, no one doing that job, a casual has to be employed etc etc. When a new employer rings up for a referance the first question they ask is sickies...then they'll do a compo check, then if you do get on theres a 3/6 month casual before full time is offered..

     

    Stevo

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    Thanks for that Kris and it is unfair and very frustrating!!

     

    What is your area of work?

     

    It's top secret and I'd have to kill you if I told you....and others too....:dull:I work in a government dept as an assistant. I'll send you a PM

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    Guest Guest5035
    It's top secret and I'd have to kill you if I told you....and others too....:dull:I work in a government dept as an assistant. I'll send you a PM

     

    a cop..

     

    stevo

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    Where I used to work we took a bloke on that had been working in IT for the Government for nearly 5 years and we got rid of him in his 3 month probation period because he could not manage a full week of work, either saying he was sick or coming up with other excuses. Where I used to work we did not have to have pre-employment medicals, but if people were not up to the job we used the probationary period or poor performance procedures to finish the person.

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    one was a fitter going for another fitters job, (hernia, after his op he rang them up and was told no job failed medical) asthma as below and that was the reason given to him..hearing, told he might not hear forklift horn or other alarms ie fire etc etc.

     

     

     

     

    believe me it happens, if a employee has a severe attack, which in turn leads to more serious implications, then theres alot of paperwork etc etc etc to be done, along with a employee off work, no one doing that job, a casual has to be employed etc etc. When a new employer rings up for a referance the first question they ask is sickies...then they'll do a compo check, then if you do get on theres a 3/6 month casual before full time is offered..

     

    Stevo

     

     

    Totally agree with Stevo. It can be hard for people in the UK to understand but the world of work in Australia can be a brutal and harsh place. In terms of sickness and peoples health it is all about what risk and liability that person is to a company. When my partner studied her Diploma in Human Resource Management, out of 8 units, 1 of the units was Managing Rehabilitation or Return to Work Programs which is all about Workcover (not a system we have in the UK) and managing people who get injuried at work, so like with everything employers look to eliminate the risk as best they can and medicals is one way of doing this.

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    Guest Guest5035
    Totally agree with Stevo. It can be hard for people in the UK to understand but the world of work in Australia can be a brutal and harsh place. In terms of sickness and peoples health it is all about what risk and liability that person is to a company. When my partner studied her Diploma in Human Resource Management, out of 8 units, 1 of the units was Managing Rehabilitation or Return to Work Programs which is all about Workcover (not a system we have in the UK) and managing people who get injuried at work, so like with everything employers look to eliminate the risk as best they can and medicals is one way of doing this.

     

    thankyou...

     

    stevo

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    a cop..

     

    stevo

     

    Definitely not a cop or even in the corrections area.....not that there is anything wrong with those professions.

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    Where I used to work we took a bloke on that had been working in IT for the Government for nearly 5 years and we got rid of him in his 3 month probation period because he could not manage a full week of work, either saying he was sick or coming up with other excuses. Where I used to work we did not have to have pre-employment medicals, but if people were not up to the job we used the probationary period or poor performance procedures to finish the person.

     

    Sounds like you have a lot of "terminators" working there. There are some employers who are compassionate too and at the end of the day employers employ people to get the job done and if someone is away a lot then it is not possible. What I find the problem is and this is steering away from original topic is that there are a lot of hypocrite employers who do not treat people fairly. In Australia our legislation requires us to treat people fairly and I know that doesn't happen. In Government departments more than others I have found that they do try because they have to but they move people on if they can. I've seen it happen with people who are on contracts the most. There is a lot of dead wood in government and a lot of these are permanent people so they are very hard to move on because they have rights and covered by awards. If someone doesn't perform the duties required in the first 3 or 6 months then I think that covers the employer because it is during the probation period. I think everyone understands that employers have the right to get a fair days work out of people. It's just that they have to take on the good days along with the bad days. Employers are people too and they get sick and so do their families.

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    Surely if you are working in IT you always have the option of going contract - in which case you are your own responsibility. Just a thought, worth checking with the agencies.

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    Go for a government job if you can get it. They do ask you questions (or the couple I have worked for have) but as far as I know they don't require a medical, not for IT work, perhaps if you were a Doctor or Nurse. IMO I don't think it is anyone's business what your illness is in relation to you getting a job or not. You can tell them after you get the job so that if anything crops up then they know how they can help if you need it. They are not allowed to do it - it is discriminatory but in practice I think a lot of places are discriminatory so pick an area/industry that is less likely to do it (like government). No one wants their staff/workers to take sick leave but that is where the double standard comes into play.....it is ok when they do it. I've been fairly healthy for a long time but the last few years it's been one thing after another and then when your family gets ill too....it's really hard. It is our right to take time off when we are ill and I look around me and see that people go on maternity leave, they take days off because their children are sick or they have caught some bug from their child. Then people take a couple of weeks off with neck and back problems. These are genuine people, terrific workers too but it happens.

     

    Some of us HAVE to take time off when our children are sick, what else are we to do? We have no family, no mum or mother in law to have the children for us if the kids do become ill. We're quite lucky in that we both have employers who let us have carer's leave, but when that gets used up, I have to take unpaid leave. It's the same over the school holidays as well when OSHC is closed, we HAVE to take leave as there's no alternative. I'm sorry if that gets up people's noses, I'm not trying to blag more time off than anyone else, we just don't have the choice.

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    Guest Jennet
    Totally agree with Stevo. It can be hard for people in the UK to understand but the world of work in Australia can be a brutal and harsh place. In terms of sickness and peoples health it is all about what risk and liability that person is to a company. When my partner studied her Diploma in Human Resource Management, out of 8 units, 1 of the units was Managing Rehabilitation or Return to Work Programs which is all about Workcover (not a system we have in the UK) and managing people who get injuried at work, so like with everything employers look to eliminate the risk as best they can and medicals is one way of doing this.

     

     

    there is a return to work program in the UK, we have it and it is used especially with long term sickness

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    Some of us HAVE to take time off when our children are sick, what else are we to do? We have no family, no mum or mother in law to have the children for us if the kids do become ill. We're quite lucky in that we both have employers who let us have carer's leave, but when that gets used up, I have to take unpaid leave. It's the same over the school holidays as well when OSHC is closed, we HAVE to take leave as there's no alternative. I'm sorry if that gets up people's noses, I'm not trying to blag more time off than anyone else, we just don't have the choice.

     

    I hear ya.

     

    We struggle with that here where we live in the UK :( We don't live near my family, no work near them for hubby, so living where we do, we have only ourselves to rely on. I can occasionally ask a friend to mind our son for an hour or two till I get home, but as most of them have their own kids/jobs also its very rare this can work out. So either hubby or I have to take time off work if our child is ill. We agreed to split it 50/50 so neither one of us has to take longer stretches off, or it all fall on me because I earn less, we do a day each on rotation usually or else a couple of days each if he is poorly with something that lingers a bit. Sometimes hubby can't take time off or is away on business so I have no choice to phone in and take time off at short notice. Its crap but that is just how it is. I spent many years working before I had my son and tbh I covered plenty for people who took time off because they had to to care for their kids. Its not fun for anyone but it can't be helped. I never had an issue doing that. I used to get really peed off though at the people who just called in a sickie when they were not actually ill or were hungover and couldn't be arsed to get up early to go to work or something. Always used to know who those people were and we'd cover for them once or twice but after that happening 3 or 4 times month, we all would simply say we couldn't fill in for them.

     

    My boss when she hired me knew this sort of thing, son being poorly, could happen. Thankfully it didn't deter her from hiring me, nor does my hubby's company have a problem with his caring for his son if ill. I was honest that from time to time I'd have to be off work to care for my son but that I'd also do all I could to ensure I could be there as much as possible, especially on the important days it would be really awkward for me to miss. So we try to balance it so hubby is home on those crucial ones I need to be at work. So far, its worked out. I think we are really lucky to both have really understanding employers (all of whom themselves have younger kids and babies so know full well that kids being ill happens and are in the same boat as us then).

     

    School holidays are awkward but thankfully we have an amazing childminder who takes our son a fair few more hours each time and therefore I only have to take the odd day off work to look after him, or hubby has to come home from work early to take over from me and so on. Its far from ideal but we juggle it all and do our best. I can't wait for being in Adelaide as we'll have no end of family who'll be able to help out, we won't know ourselves!

     

    Its an impossible situation really for most parents. We were all not parents once, so know the other side of the coin and how it goes. But having kids does change things and while most do what they can, sometimes they just cannot come in to work, as much as they might want to.

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    Guest Guest5035

    I agree we have to pull a sickie if one of the family is ill, i've done it myself, where i work we get paid out any unused sickies if theres a retrenchment, i have 600+ plus hours....

     

    stevo

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    Guest Sachertorte
    Some of us HAVE to take time off when our children are sick, what else are we to do? We have no family, no mum or mother in law to have the children for us if the kids do become ill. We're quite lucky in that we both have employers who let us have carer's leave, but when that gets used up, I have to take unpaid leave. It's the same over the school holidays as well when OSHC is closed, we HAVE to take leave as there's no alternative. I'm sorry if that gets up people's noses, I'm not trying to blag more time off than anyone else, we just don't have the choice.

     

    Very good point! It is very difficult to cope during the Xmas holidays when you have to cover for the absence of childcare and have no extended family to turn to.

    I have had to give up my career when I came here because of the limitations we had looking after the children.

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