Neighbourhoods to avoid?

[Guest Libby1971]

Flippin' eck luv, you're brave!!!:notworthy:

 

Stand behind me, we'll fight our way through 'em!

 

Libby

[Guest Nick11]

I agree with the other comments that it is a personal choice, but as no one wants to name names I will!!!

 

We are a professional couple aged 29 and 34 with no children, so what is right for us might not be right for other people, but hopefully it will give you something to work with.

 

Generally suburbs close to the city centre tend to be the most expensive, whereas in the UK where we lived they were the areas to avoid!

 

Some of the suburbs we like: Glenelg, Norwood, Stepney, Unley, Parkside, Goodwood, Wayville, Eastwood, Clarence Park, Millswood, Magill, Prospect to name a few.

 

Suburbs we would not choose to live in: Christies Beach, Hackham, Elizabeth, Salisbury, Smithfield Plains, Daveron Park, Blair Athol to name a few.

 

We have recently bought a house and had an idea where we wanted to buy, but we did find the 'Where to Live' book that people have mentioned previously useful and it confirmed our thoughts that we were buying a property in a good area that would be a good investment.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Run for the hills girl!

Get out while you can!

[Rachiegarlo]

I guess it's a case of not wanting to tread on people's toes who may live in these areas and think they are great.... same with naming schools you would fight tooth and nail to avoid despite the blurb given out by the schools. Adelaide is a small place and once you've been here for a while people will place you in the scheme of things by asking where you live, but more importantly where you send your children to school or if you are from here where you went to school.. Well certain sections will. I also would not live in Christies beach, downs,heights. Hackham, Hackham west especially, ( people can get you anything you need there, you just have to ask). I wouldn't live anywhere North of Regency Rd unless it was out Gawler way. Also around Arndale shopping centre. But it is what you are used to I suppose and also where you feel you belong. Also some of these areas are changing. I really recommend Blackwood/ Coromandel Valley/Belair for families, 4 br houses, some with pools can still be had for a reasonable price. They are all in the hills 20 mins to town and big shopping areas. A choice of schools. Anyway It depends what you want.

[Jessica Berry]

Run for the hills girl!

Get out while you can!

 

 

LOL!! You must remember that we live in Australia now where they say it like it is and not politically correct, don't tell the truth or you will upset people England!!!

 

This is one of the many reasons why I love living in Australia.

[Jessica Berry]

Flippin' eck luv, you're brave!!!:notworthy:

 

Stand behind me, we'll fight our way through 'em!

 

Libby

 

 

LOL!! If you look on the poms site this thread has the most viewings so its obviously the question people want to know and instead of wishy washy politically correct answers I gave my honest opinion, but like I said what is a right area for us may not be the right area for everyone and as we do not have children the areas I have listed are generally the suburbs for people without children (unless you have a lot of money to buy the larger properties), so come on poms with kids, be brave and start naming names and help people out.

 

If you look on www.realestate.com.au you can buy a 3 bed with swimming pool in Davoren Park for offers above $140,000, like the saying goes 'if it seems too good to be true it probably is!

[Guest Guzzler&Sas]

What also might help, is for people to speak from their experiences of living in suburbs rather than just hear say,

 

Guzzler

[Guest Guest75]

Well it's getting like a Little Britain here in Onk Hills - there are four Pom families from what I know.:biglaugh:

 

Seriously it is very hard to give an opinion on all suburbs here.Having lived here for nearly 8 years I only know a few well.

 

 

There is a bit of everything for everyone here- just sometimes takes some finding.

 

Once here it's obviously easier,but even then I'd spend a lot of time considering where to live.We drove through the suburb we live in at all times of day,asked lots of locals and so on.:)

[Rachiegarlo]

Okay.

I have lived in.

North Adelaide : so close to the city, you can walk in and out in 10 minutes. Close to universities, thatres, cinemas,surrounded by parklands. OÇonnell st has lots of browsing shops, resteraunts and cafes. Shopping centre is overpriced. 1 primary school, 1 catholic girls school rec to yr 12, 2 kindys. Horses are kept on the nearby parklands and the playground is fully enclosed. Perrymans bakery next to the school does really nice pies, pasties and cakes. When I lived there residents of the area sent their children to private or Walkerville primary. North Adelaide primary was filled mostly with children from northern suburbs, from families that thought it would be better than their local school. The school has changed and is used by professionals. It is also zoned. This suburb is very pricey now.

 

Eastwood: 10 - 15 mins from town across the south east parklands. Small enclosed suburb of a bout 6 streets. 2 playgrounds, 1 kindy Used to be excellent when my kids went there. 2 shopping centres close by. some discount shopping to be had on the main road. Access to Unley High and Glenunga international high school Tightly held suburb, very quiet, fairly expensive now.

 

Parkside : safe to walk around at night. Low levels of crime, but usually entails break ins , car theft etc rather than physical violence. Parkside primary, Unley or Glenunga High 1 christian primary school. 1 lutheran primary school and 1 lutheran high school close by. Lots of choice of shopping centres close by. Older houses that have been redeveloped now, so prices have risen accordingly. Around $600,000

might buy you something here.

 

Nailsworth: worth a look, house prices $400-600, 000. Safe to walk around, lot of families moved in in the last 10 - 15 years. My mum lives here. Its 6 kms from town. 2 bus routes on either side of the suburb. A good shopping centre about 5 mins away in the car. There is 1 primary school, that is average to good, becoming more popular. 1 library and community centre. Crime again is more of the theft variety rather than personal harm. No large gatherings of menacing youths. On the edge of the zone for 1 high school, sorry cant remember the new name , they renamed it when it amalgamated with nailsworth high. People living here try to send there children elsewhere anyway for high school. There is 1 catholic girls high nearby, 1 catholic boys school.rec-yr12 nearby and 1 7th day adventist high school in the next suburb.

 

South Plympton. House prices are upper 300s - mid 400s. This is where I live, we bought our house here 10 years ago. very stable area, about 1/3 of the houses are still lived in by the original buyer. The suburb was developed as a war trust housing area for returned sevicemen after WW2. There is a small area of Housing trust housing, but they are loked after well and the inhabitants don't cause trouble. There are no large gangs roaming the area. These houses are solid, 2-3 bedroom homes, double brick in a good size garden, from when families expected to grow fruit tree,s have a veggie patch, keep chickens etc. it is still possible to buy a deceased estate type here, but lol the decor is usually remeniscent of the 70s so if you don't mind renovating it is a good place to look. This suburb is 10 mins by car away from Marion shopping centre( the 2nd biggest in Australia), Brighton, Hove, Glenelg beaches, the city. The train goes through here, several bus routes, and the tram(10 - 15 mins right into town or the other way to Glenelg.) There is 1 primary school, not so good, used to have behavioural probs, but a lot of asians(Far East not Pakistani) are moving into the area. Another primary school close by is Zoned but there are places sometimes, good school with lots of parental involvement (Black Forest primary). On the edge of the zone for Charles Sturt high rec - 12 school. Don't hear much about this school, it has had its ups and downs. People do try to get their kids into Unley. There is 1 christian school Tabor College which is good ,but comes with the happy clappy type of religious views, that can be trying if you are not that way inclined. It has a sliding fee scale depending on what you earn. It's a popular local alternative, from REC - yr 12. There is 1 kindy, numerous large shopping centres with supermarkets, fruit n veg shops, bakeries etc. Safe to walk around in at night Crime is of the theft variety and no more than any where else in Adelaide. Small amount of graffiti usually limited to shop walls etc. Not much vandalism to personal property, your wheely bin might get stolen, mine never has but the local Community watch advises putting bin out on the collection morning rather than the night before. Some people are putting on a 2nd storey rather than moving. The houses are on the smaller side but are great starter houses if you have small children or 1or 2 teens. House prices in this suburb continue to rise at a greater rate than other areas. You would not lose money here because of the locality, and the houses although may have extensions etc are not over developed for the area. My son is 18 and goes out at night regularly with his friends, the close proximity to town and the beach with the transport options mean he is not dependent on me to drive him everywhere. Similarly my 17 and 14 yr old daughters can access town, Glenelg and Marion centres easily, and I feel that my older daughter is safe coming home on the tram if she goes late night shopping in town on a Friday( shops open until 9).

 

My brother lives in Hawthorndene, in the hills near Belair. Beautiful suburb, still close to everything. He has a 4br with pool overlooking a valley and the hills beyond. The area has a gd choice of schools and you can get a good house for about $400,000-500000. There are some smaller houses for around 350,000- 400,000. Very safe area.

 

Schools my children have been to , go to....

Linden Park Primary school.... Excellent, situated in Linden Park. This school follows the primary yrs IB curriculum fromREC to yr 5 and begins the IB middle yrs program for yrs 6 and 7. There are always a good number of students who get scholarships to private schools or get a place in the IGNITE program(accelerated learning, yrs 8 & 9 in one yr) at Glenunga High. French is the language studied at this school. It has swimming carnival and sports day with the emphasis on fun types of games for all and not just athletics for the sporty types.They enrol a lot of international students from Korea and for the last couple of years a couple of students have taken part in a tour of Korea. Student discipline levels are good with measures rarely having to go beyond sitting in the corridor, usually a verbal warning is enough. Parents are extremely involved in their children's education. About 1/3 go onto private schools.

 

The high schools I use are St John's Grammer in Belair and Annesley college in Wayville, I won't go into them here as I just remembered this thread is about housing lol....

 

Rachel

[Guest Nick11]

LOL!! You must remember that we live in Australia now where they say it like it is and not politically correct, don't tell the truth or you will upset people England!!!

 

This is one of the many reasons why I love living in Australia.

 

Very true mate , but remember you can take the pom out of blighty , but not blighty out of the pom - if you know what I mean!

[Guest realnicegal]

Yes, please see below and contact me if you wish! Available from 2 August 2008.

 

We have a bedsit called The Snuggery specifically decked out for professional overseas people working or migrating to Adelaide. University graduate students and professional interstate workers welcome too. Book for one month to one year and anything in between. PayPal deposit required for overseas bookings.

 

Sea views from bed, very clean good looking accommodation. Fully furnished and with tv,dvd,stereo and decked out for comfort. Ikea furniture and very comfy bed. Tiny courtyard. Double glazing. Washing machine and use of dryer. Practical kitchenette and great bathroom, separate toilet. $300 per week includes broadband, linen, towels, all furnishings, electricity, water and kitchen utensils - no more to pay.

 

Beach less than 10 minute's walk.

 

Train to Adelaide Central Railway Station takes 25 minutes and runs until just after midnight. Train station 1 minute walk away. Bus stop over the road.

[Guest Greg and Karen]

Hi all

 

any first hand experiences / thoughts on Aberfoyle Park, Woodcroft, Darlington, Flagstaff Hill, O'Halloran Hill area? 20kms south of cbd apparently.

 

books/internet viewed from UK paint a good picture

 

we're a family with a 4 year old and new edition due october. I'm a solicitor so would need reasonable access to the cbd I imagine

 

are the schools in these areas any good? crime, house prices etc?

 

thanks for any pointers

 

Greg

[Guest realnicegal]

Hi Greg

 

Now this answer is going to shock and horrify some people. And some of them will be ex pats who are renting out property in our far flung southern suburbs and those suburbs happen to include Aberfoyle Park, Woodcroft, Darlington, Flagstaff Hill, O'Halloran Hill, Hallett Cove:

 

If you are a professional worker and you're coming to Australia for a fabulous new life, then don't move to any of those suburbs. They are outer suburban and a wee bit depressing.

 

Depressing..... suburb after suburb after poorly designed suburb with architectural nightmares .... dull .... lifeless .... suburbia ...... .

 

Your kids and wife and you could be wishing like hell you were going back.

 

Adelaide is best taken with a pinch of beach.

 

However, if you think you can still live 20 kilometres away from the CBD but have a touch of quality architectural design, history, sailling, swimming etc by our beautiful beaches you might like to try the following: Brighton, Seacliff, Marino. If you want that stuff and would like a more urban setting try Glenelg, Glenelg South, Henley Beach, Prospect. If you want inner city living try Norwood, Unley, Unley Park, Hyde Park, North Adelaide, Medindie

[Guest Guest75]

Hi Greg

 

Now this answer is going to shock and horrify some people. And some of them will be ex pats who are renting out property in our far flung southern suburbs and those suburbs happen to include Aberfoyle Park, Woodcroft, Darlington, Flagstaff Hill, O'Halloran Hill, Hallett Cove:

 

If you are a professional worker and you're coming to Australia for a fabulous new life, then don't move to any of those suburbs. They are outer suburban and a wee bit depressing.

 

Depressing..... suburb after suburb after poorly designed suburb with architectural nightmares .... dull .... lifeless .... suburbia ...... .

 

Your kids and wife and you could be wishing like hell you were going back.

 

Adelaide is best taken with a pinch of beach.

 

However, if you think you can still live 20 kilometres away from the CBD but have a touch of quality architectural design, history, sailling, swimming etc by our beautiful beaches you might like to try the following: Brighton, Seacliff, Marino. If you want that stuff and would like a more urban setting try Glenelg, Glenelg South, Henley Beach, Prospect. If you want inner city living try Norwood, Unley, Unley Park, Hyde Park, North Adelaide, Medindie

 

 

Sorry but I disagree with this.

 

Yup it did shock and horrify me and has nothing to do with the fact we have rentals in the south - based here because it is a popular area for settlement.

 

What will be a deciding factor is budget.

There are some lovely houses in the areas mentioned (and further south too)

I live in Onkaparinga Hills which is not too far away from the aforementioned suburbs.I've lived here 8 years now and seen some real changes - yes including some pretty "ordinary" housing.There are some gems still around and you just need to look closer.

 

There are some pretty awful houses in the areas you mention - you just have to pay a lot more for one though!!

 

There is a lot of stunning housing in the areas you mention - but the prices!!!

Also it feels too much like suburbia for most people,I often drive through those areas,can afford to buy there but choose to live down south.

 

Comments on "best suburbs" are best taken with a "pinch of salt"

Nothing beats seeing the city ,and what it has to offer for yourself.

I find there is something for everyone here - it sometimes just takes some finding.

[Guest Libby1971]

We had OAA in Everard Park and I am not likely to go back there any time soon.

 

We rented in Sheidow Park - no shops in the suburb. What was a shopping centre was conveted to expand the school which is led by a wishy washy head with the presence of a damp teatowel but who is involved with the kids, joining the school band etc. The kids are happy and Woodend School was great at helping our youngest settle. Zoned for Seaview High School which older ones need to bus to. IMO this HS is a little rough around the edges and our eldest didn't do well here. Prices are rising in this area due to a new development. We were told by a real estate agent it is a good alternative to Hallett Cove as it is across the road (Brighton Road) and houses are about $20k at least cheaper. It is sandwiched between Brighton Road and South Road which are 2 main routes into the city with an entrance/ exit to the expressway to the city mins away. Ten mins to Colonnades, ten to Marion and no more than ten to the beach - great location.

 

Reynella East - a little nugget of a place IMO. On the edge of Happy Valley and Woodcroft, houses here are mostly built in the 70s/ 80s and are 3-4 beds. Some have pools. Reynella East has a good primary and a good High Schoo,which offer the IM programme. Both are girls are doing well here. Prices for a 3 bed are about $250k plus and prices in this suburb are rising rapidly. There is a park and ride at the end of the road and 2 bus routes into the city. There are shops nearby and again ten mins to Marion and 10 to Colonnades. Flatter than Sheidow Park.

 

The suburbs that realnicegal mentions are pricey, gardens usually have higher fences all the way around the fronts and while they are great for beach living, their prices put them out of the reach for many. I wouldn't say that anyone leaving their life in the UK is going to find anything about the suburbs she mentions that makes life in Adelaide different from the UK - personally I wanted some thing diff/ better and I wouldn't have found life any diff in the suburbs she lists. I found these suburbs full of traffic when I drove through and incredibly noisy. The houses are either old and dated or sometimes very nice. A friend of mine bought in Norwood and is bitterly regretting the decision as she has found that the lifestyle she wants for her daughter is better in the southern suburbs listed throughout this thread.

 

I would like to point out though that from the UK we had dismissed Sheidow and Reynella East as being too close to the city as we were from a market town and wanted a similar feel. We thought about Willunga or Aldinga. However we found that we could be closer to the city nad have the feel we wanted. All these viewpoints are from people who have a bias in some way so to be honest, totally ignore everything that is said. Come here for yourself, buy/ hire a car and drive around, time yourself getting to various locations around the city etc and make up your own mind.

[Guest Nick11]

Hi Greg

 

Now this answer is going to shock and horrify some people. And some of them will be ex pats who are renting out property in our far flung southern suburbs and those suburbs happen to include Aberfoyle Park, Woodcroft, Darlington, Flagstaff Hill, O'Halloran Hill, Hallett Cove:

 

If you are a professional worker and you're coming to Australia for a fabulous new life, then don't move to any of those suburbs. They are outer suburban and a wee bit depressing.

 

Depressing..... suburb after suburb after poorly designed suburb with architectural nightmares .... dull .... lifeless .... suburbia ...... .

 

Your kids and wife and you could be wishing like hell you were going back.

 

Adelaide is best taken with a pinch of beach.

 

However, if you think you can still live 20 kilometres away from the CBD but have a touch of quality architectural design, history, sailling, swimming etc by our beautiful beaches you might like to try the following: Brighton, Seacliff, Marino. If you want that stuff and would like a more urban setting try Glenelg, Glenelg South, Henley Beach, Prospect. If you want inner city living try Norwood, Unley, Unley Park, Hyde Park, North Adelaide, Medindie

 

Personally I found that houses in Marino,Brighton, Seacliff, Glenelg, Henley Beach were pretty dull - except those on the beach front - which we could never have afforded in a million years. But beauty is in the eye of the holder and all that .......

Really don't like inner city living all - not for my family at all - but you need to check it out to decide for yourselves.

[Guest kate]

Everyone is looking for something thats in there price range and that suits there family, so in saying that to be honest with all the brits looking at your last thread, all those eastern suburbs and Western beach properties they are lovely and all that fluffy stuff but not everyones budget!!!! The average joe bloe on average wages couldnt afford a family home there, thats the only reply i have. Good on ya for talking up with guts though!

[Rachiegarlo]

Yeah I just posted about areas I had first hand knowledge of. My main piece of advice is when you are looking at your suburbs, get off the main roads and also get out of the car and go for a walk. Check out the shops, the parks etc and go back on the weekends, cos some suburbs are dead during the day cos everyone leaves to work to pay those hefty mortgages. Also if you don't mind the commute and want a country town feel have a look at the small towns like Mount Compass which is only 40 mins drive away. These towns are growing with new developments that keep a rural aspect to them. Also around Mount Barker in the hills.

[Guest Guzzler&Sas]

wow, wow, wow ....

 

everyone is always very passionate about this subject, but it is such a HUGE topic. As others have said, and we said too, it comes down to affordability - who wants to be mortgaged up to the hilt and not afford to do things in this magnificent country!

 

Christies Beach, O'Sullivans Beach and Hackham (to name a few!) always take a beating on all these sites and we have first hand experience of living real close by, but I would just like to mention that the property hot spots discussed in The Advertiser last week, was exactly these places. There are under developed, have cheaper houses and are ripe for redevelopment. There may be other things about these areas that need shaping up, but if you are looking for a bargain, then consider these.

 

Yes, many of the suburbs mentioned nearer the city are nice, but I expect there are still problems with living there ..... as there are anywhere and if you can't afford to live there, then what is the point? We love living where we do and would not swap it ... but that is just our opinion.

 

Sas

xxx

[Guest Nick11]

wow, wow, wow ....

 

everyone is always very passionate about this subject, but it is such a HUGE topic. As others have said, and we said too, it comes down to affordability - who wants to be mortgaged up to the hilt and not afford to do things in this magnificent country!

 

Christies Beach, O'Sullivans Beach and Hackham (to name a few!) always take a beating on all these sites and we have first hand experience of living real close by, but I would just like to mention that the property hot spots discussed in The Advertiser last week, was exactly these places. There are under developed, have cheaper houses and are ripe for redevelopment. There may be other things about these areas that need shaping up, but if you are looking for a bargain, then consider these.

 

Yes, many of the suburbs mentioned nearer the city are nice, but I expect there are still problems with living there ..... as there are anywhere and if you can't afford to live there, then what is the point? We love living where we do and would not swap it ... but that is just our opinion.

 

Sas

xxx

 

Quite agree mate. We didn't look at those areas when we came here as we were put off by ex-pats - wish we had now as they are some lovely places to be seen around there.

Yes Brighton, Glenelg etc are lovely - but packed with tourists in summer - but house prices are crazy.

We love south of the city - especially woodcroft, noarlunga etc and wouldn't change it for the world. We hardly ever go north of here!

[The Monaghans]

Hi Greg

 

Now this answer is going to shock and horrify some people. And some of them will be ex pats who are renting out property in our far flung southern suburbs and those suburbs happen to include Aberfoyle Park, Woodcroft, Darlington, Flagstaff Hill, O'Halloran Hill, Hallett Cove:

 

If you are a professional worker and you're coming to Australia for a fabulous new life, then don't move to any of those suburbs. They are outer suburban and a wee bit depressing.

 

Depressing..... suburb after suburb after poorly designed suburb with architectural nightmares .... dull .... lifeless .... suburbia ...... .

 

Your kids and wife and you could be wishing like hell you were going back.

 

Adelaide is best taken with a pinch of beach.

 

However, if you think you can still live 20 kilometres away from the CBD but have a touch of quality architectural design, history, sailling, swimming etc by our beautiful beaches you might like to try the following: Brighton, Seacliff, Marino. If you want that stuff and would like a more urban setting try Glenelg, Glenelg South, Henley Beach, Prospect. If you want inner city living try Norwood, Unley, Unley Park, Hyde Park, North Adelaide, Medindie

 

Yah boo sucks to you! We live in Woodcroft and we think it's lovely. Yes, it's quiet and suburban. It's also leafy and well established and ideal for young families. Don't slag places off to people who aren't here yet, it's not fair. Let them make up their own minds when they get here, you're really not helping anyone.

[Guest ems]

Hi everyone

Can i just say that i've been following this thread for ages now and it has really opened my eyes to things. When i found out i'd been offered a job in Adelaide, after childcare my next big thoughts were on where i would live. I had the same thoughts as everyone, i need a good family suburb with good schools for my daughter. I think now i realise that the most important thing is giving places a go, and that i won't know anything till i get there. I know i need to be around 10-15 mins away from the Royal Adelaide hospital as the further i live the more i will have to pay in childcare (which i have seen won't be very cheap as i will need it to cover shift work inc nights + wkends). Thanks to everyone for the info that has been put on here, it has really helped.

 

Emma +

Alicia (6)

[Rachiegarlo]

yep areas do change. Christies Beach High school was so big it had to be fitted on 2 campuses next to each other and behaviour was notorious. Now it's 1 small school and there's lots of new building going on down there. I actually think that you are all dead lucky to be able to move here and pick anywhere. I already had ties to the inner city and now it's where my kids go to school, where their activities and friends live and where I work. Being a nurse doing shift work I wouldnt be able to drive that far after night duty or leave at 6am, but there are plenty that do. It really comes down to choice. I would still say that areas in Adelaide are good to avoid simply because who wants to be the only employed person in the street with a house full of goodies ripe for picking.

[Ranger]

Totally agree, sums it up well

[Guest ems]

yep areas do change. Christies Beach High school was so big it had to be fitted on 2 campuses next to each other and behaviour was notorious. Now it's 1 small school and there's lots of new building going on down there. I actually think that you are all dead lucky to be able to move here and pick anywhere. I already had ties to the inner city and now it's where my kids go to school, where their activities and friends live and where I work. Being a nurse doing shift work I wouldnt be able to drive that far after night duty or leave at 6am, but there are plenty that do. It really comes down to choice. I would still say that areas in Adelaide are good to avoid simply because who wants to be the only employed person in the street with a house full of goodies ripe for picking.

 

 

Cheers for that Rachel, i will def take your last sentence on board. I'm sure i've seen a website which has some sort of statistics on areas with high/low emloyment. I think i will try and dig that out again. Emma.

[Guest lastboyscout]

I`ve been reading this thread with great interest.

 

With us yet to make the big move, we have considered alot of things like schools, nice houses etc. but I still keep coming back to the same thing, that keeps going round in my head.

 

Whilst alot of people on here have gone over to Adelaide with loads of money in the bank etc. we will not unfortunately be in that boat I have a job to go to which will pay about the same as here, but we are not going over to make our fortune. We are going over for a better quality of life, somewhere safe and secure for my family to grow, space to breathe and not feel `cramped in`, we hope to not feel that we need to buy this and that to keep up with the `Joneses` and to make a new start as we feel that this country has no more to offer my young family.

 

We can all dream about owning the big house with a pool, but for us that is a very distant dream, one we hope to achieve with alot of hard work, but I took my rose tinted glasses off a while ago and know that it will be hard work both financially and emotionally, to settle the kids firstly, then Michelle and me after:)

 

Anyone got a spare fiver?